Coil turns 1-4 is very easy and not challenging for a healer

[Shiyo]

I find that turns 1-4 coil is extremely easy and unchallenging for a healer. I don't have much to actually "do", everything is scaled to just hit really hard so as a scholar I basically have to stand there and mash "121212121" over and over to keep the tank(s) alive, rarely dodging AOE or rarely avoiding/predicting any sort of damage - because it's constant burst damage on your tank(s). This isn't very fun as a healer, for me, at least. I don't find it fun to just stand in place, spam 2 buttons, occasionally move 2steps to the side, and continue spamming 2 buttons.

The only way I could possibly mess up or do "Bad" as a healer in coil is by simply not pressing my 2 cure buttons every GCD. As you gear up, you're able to DPS a bit more, but it doesn't help a lot of bosses are immune to slow, immune to blind, have no real predictable AOE/burst attack(besides twintania, you can virus and predict his attack coming yay fun! but this isn't about turn5). In every other content for this game, as a scholar, I am constantly predicting damage, reducing incoming AOE/burst by pre-shielding/virusing/sacred soiling it, DPSing during burst phases(titans heart, ifrit nails, random 4 man bosses with low damage or the boss is CCed like the golem in qarn), blinding table flips, blinding huge single target damage on the tank, etc etc. I am constantly doing many different things, and not simply standing there pressing 2 buttons, in coil turns 1-4 however, this is basically ALL I can do because things are either immune to blind/slow, or have no predictable AOE/burst and just hit hard on every single attack, as well as hit hard every single second so I have on time to really stop to DPS or play as a "support" and have to play as a healbot.


In coil turns 1-4, the only thing that can 1 shot me is basically allagan rot, but even if I'm not paying attention, the next person in our "pattern" can run to me, and pick up the rot, and continue to the chain. I could basically completely ignore the mechanic, dodge the straight line AOE's every ~45 seconds, sit there spamming 1212121 and be fine. Turn1 Cadecus, probably the worst fight in the entire game(pretty much PURE tank and spank) randomly throws things every 30s, so I might have to move 2 steps while spamming 1212121, then very very rarely changes the floor where I'm standing so I have to move a bit more to avoid adds. But I rarely have to move, I have to move less than 5 times during that fight, and I spend the majority(95%+), spamming my 2 cures and doing nothing else. I can't blind this boss, he's immune, I can't slow him, he's immune, he's constantly doing insane damage to my tank, so I can't DPS, I can't virus some incoming huge attack or AOE, everything he does does huge damage so I just have to throw virus everytime it's up or save for multiple stacks, and the same could be said with sacred soil ande ye for an eye.

Let's compare this to titan, a fantastic and engaging fight:

I can easily mess up, if I don't dodge. One single mistake, I get thrown off the edge, one mistake, bombs 1 shot me(depending on my hp), or two shot me if I have two bombs on me. If I don't predict the incoming table flip combo on my tank and pre-shield/top them off? The tank dies. If I don't pre-shield everyone then spam cures for the incoming tumult spam? Everyone gets very low HP or dies. If I don't dodge plumes quick enough? 2 will kill me. These things I need to dodge aren't once every ~30 seconds, a few times an encounter, they're CONSTANTLY thrown at me every 5-10 seconds, I'm constantly either forced to predict incoming burst on the tank, burst on everyone, or dodgable attacks I need to get out of the way for that will kill me. The entire fight is constantly challenging me and making me pay attention 100%, I can also DPS during the heart phase, blind Table flips to reduce damage, pre-virus and pre-shield incoming tumults, and pre-shield incoming table flips on the tank. There is so much for me to do. Unlike coil, I am constantly on my toes and on the brink of death every GCD, while also having a lot of "Extra" I can do to make the fight easier.

Even fights in lesser dungeons, like stone vigil, Qarn, Aurum vale, etc, all have lots of things I can be actively doing to make things easier(pre-shielding burst, virusing burst, DPSing), as well as lots of things I need to actively dodge or I'll be 1 shot. These are LOWBIE dungeons made for leveling.

What's the point of this thread? Turn 1-4 of coil is very boring for a healer, I hope future "Hard" content isn't simply just making things hit extremely hard and be immune to all debuffs, but it isn't fun at all for a healer, and I find myself extremely bored every week doing coil turns 1-4 in the 45 mins it takes my group to do. I don't find spamming 2 buttons over and over while occasionally moving every 30-45 seconds very fun or challenging, the fact that the only way I can essentially mess up and be a "Bad player" in coil turns 1-4 is by not spamming 1212 is really blah. When I want fun, I help random groups do coil, solo healing coil as a scholar is also harder than anything you can do in Titan hardmode, which is pretty sad. The final end game raid that drops the best gear should be home to the most fun and challenging encounters the game has to offer. Please SE, do not release such generic, boring "Hard" content, make more bosses like titan.

[MisakiSatomi]

Everything is also boring for a DD. Give me more red shit.

[Shiyo]

Everything is also boring for a DD. Give me more red shit.

I imagine so, I was watching the fights and as a DPS you basically are in the same position. You stand there doing your DPS rotation and have to almost never dodge - the only way you could possibly mess up as a DPS is by not knowing your rotation. This is doubly true for ranged DPS which have even LESS to watch out for and avoid.

[silverhope]

I like how u say "healers" when ur only a sch and have no way to know how it is on a whm.. also you have zero allegen pieces.. so if its so easy why dont you ahve loot? go troll somewhere else. kthx

[Volcano]

It's really no different then any other fight, because all titan is, is a bunch of moving while healing, not really any less boring. coil is a spam heal fest. much like most of the endgame fights as healer, and the previous leveling dungeons, perhaps you are just bored as a healer period. Or maybe we see healers different, because unless you are trying to be the unique snowflake DPSing alot it does not really change for most of the content in this game currently.

Also the fact that you are main SCH has me even less convinced because they have it incredibly easier compared to WHM, who they heavly depend on in coil.

[Req]

Turns 1-4 are definitely less challenging than they were originally advertised to be, but I feel like that has a lot to do with SE underestimating the player base. They did after all supposedly hold back CTs release to 2.1 because it was deemed "too hard.' Whether that is true or not, or they are just so far behind they wanted to save it so we have content in 2.1 coming out is something we will never know. Either way, if you think turn 1-4 is easy go try turn 5 because you will have to be very aware of your surroundings in every phase and you can't just spam heals.

I like how u say "healers" when ur only a sch and have no way to know how it is on a whm.. also you have zero allegen pieces.. so if its so easy why dont you ahve loot? go troll somewhere else. kthx

You seem upset. Its just as easy on WHM by the way.

[zdub303]

also you have zero allegen pieces.. so if its so easy why dont you ahve loot? go troll somewhere else. kthx

...I mean... really? How does difficulty of an encounter even equate to the presence of allagan gear? RNG + loot lockouts make it very likely for people clearing coil weekly to not have any gear, regardless of the difficulty of content. I'm on turn 5 as well and I don't have any allagan loot.. why? cause its never dropped! Not that unlikely tbh.

@OP: I think you are complaining more about class design than encounter design at this point.

Although I kind of agree that turn 4 is really only difficult on the phase transitions (picking up and holding agro) for tanks and otherwise its just a gear/dps check.

I'm hoping turn 5 is a prelude to turns 6+. Maybe we'll see some real challenge from EM primals and eventually from GMM HM and EM (im pretty confident GMM NM is gonna be pretty simple).

[Ryios]

Imo, SE thinking things are too hard irritates me. The harder something is, the harder I apply myself and the more awesome I am. Nothing is to hard, there's no such thing. Something is only too hard if your a quitter. The problem then could be interpreted as SE thinks it's player base is a bunch of quitters. And to that they might be correct to a certain degree. But we are not all quitters. I don't care how hard something is, I will go at it till I clear it.

[Whippet]

snip.

tl:dr but are you at least Dpsing in turn 1-4?

[HaiHai]

Well I've been dps'ing turns 1-5 and I can't really say it's much different as a Dragoon either, and melee is probably the most exciting role to play in this game with all the junk these encounters throw in/on melee.

The simple fact of the matter here is that turns 1-4 are tuned way too easy. So much so that you can breeze through them within a relatively short amount of time depending on the time your group will commit to learning them. Perhaps a couple weeks at most. This creates an unnecessarily large and steep wall of progression at turn 5. Not only is turn 5 much more difficult mechanically then turns 1-4, but it's also extremely more gear dependent.

The design philosophy behind this baffles me. Raids should be a progressive sloped increase of difficulty/gear, not a flat plain of easy bosses followed by a brick wall at the final boss. It's almost as if they intentionally made it this way so that large amounts of players and casuals could do all the content easily, and then made the final boss at release this way on purpose just so the more hardcore players can't complain about everything being too easy since 1 boss wasn't a joke.