Conjurer & White Mage Abilities and Spells Feedback

[v_jones]

Benediction is a joke btw when compared to Lustrate, for a change
Benediction heals 100% hp with a cooldown of 5 minutes
Lustrate heals 20% max hp with 1 second cooldown and can be cast 3 times per minute, or 300% hp healed over the same 5 minutes

How much it can heal over x amount of time is irrelevant; it's there to recover from mistakes or abnormal situations. If the tank is sitting at 10-15% hp and a big attack is coming, the only thing that matter is how much health you can dump on him or her in <2 seconds. Benediction is clearly superior.

I don't think there's any reason to get an ability to generate mana outside of potions. Healer mana has always acted as a soft rage timer for most encounters, and even if they were to provide mana restoring abilities, the encounters would have to be modified to leave us taxed regardless. I'd much rather see an additional mechanic to enhance other players, but not just as additional passive effects to spells as in the OP. Scholars get Aetherflow and Carbies, while White Mages are left with only Freecure/Overcure (which I do like).

I'd like to see Aero and Regen have additional effects upon a separate activator. Tossing Aero on a mob and activating it will remove the spell and provide 15% haste to those in melee range. Casting a Regen on a player with the haste buff and activating it will consume the Regen and provide a stat boot (+20 STR and DEX). Basically, give me something to do when I'm not healing, besides waiting to heal again.

[Valiant]

How much it can heal over x amount of time is irrelevant; it's there to recover from mistakes or abnormal situations. If the tank is sitting at 10-15% hp and a big attack is coming, the only thing that matter is how much health you can dump on him or her in <2 seconds. Benediction is clearly superior.

I would have to agree with you on that one. CD doesnt matter if I need a large enough heal to heal the Tank for an incoming attack that could take 50% or more HP away. It would mean SCH would need to use its ability more often to prevent such a situation, in which case it would then be more useful. Only question then would be MP restoration, can a SCH keep it up for the whole fight if necessary?

[Thunderz]

snip

its a panic button basically but 2 healers that are well coordinated can just drop their large cures on the tank (I prefer 1.0 benediction its dumb that they turned it into a Limit break >.> and the LB doesn't even heal the entire party to full)

SS was a spell you could use on the fly for dmg mitigation and since most party of 8 you had two healers you would rotate it through out the fight which seriously helped the tank (and party when you AoE casted it on them, which also reminds me...we lost AoE casting ability too :/) I don't see how you guys can defend the change.

Also POM is garbage compared to what it was in 1.0. They turned a insta cast no CD ability to spell speed (which is really not that great tbh) and give blm a insta cast ability... which WHM can equip.

Then they take out our MP regeneration ability and essentially give it to SCH.... and we can't borrow it...remind me whats the point of the armory system again.

I also hate the stupid Freecure RNG mechanic (spam cure 1 to maybe get a free cure2!) what...really... no

i'm not enjoying all these changes. At all

edit: I honestly believe they made WHM the way it is to justify having a BRD in the party (and not to outshine SCH) which is pretty sad

[Stormraven]

Where do you get Cura and Sacred Prism? I don't know where to go for these Quested spells.

[SunDriedRainbow]

Those are just spells that the OP made up in an effort to make a WHM spell list more to his/her tastes.

[Thunderz]

Those are just spells that the OP made up in an effort to make a WHM spell list more to his/her tastes.

Those spells existed in 1.0, educate yourself b4 you post

@Stormraven - SE took them out of the game which is why we are debating the issue

[Maldalewyn]

First thing I will say is this is not v1.0 or v1.23 or whatever and feel as a community we should focus less on how things used to work back then.

Stoneskin I find very useful. I would never waste the cast time on it during battle however, but prior to a pull it can be beneficial to cast it on DPS and yourself. It gives a little bit of breathing space should you or a DPS start to take damage. Its largely pointless casting on a tank unless your expecting them to take a large initial amount of damage.

This is part of the problem with the spell. Regardless of what previous iterations were like, using this spell between battles on anymore than one party member is currently more of an annoyance than anything. People within your party throughout dungeons will constantly be taking damage regardless of their position as a DD or Mage or Healer unless your Tank is absolutely extraordinary and the enemies somehow neglect doing any sort of AoE against him. Reapplying Stoneskin to these weaker members who receive the least amount of shielding from Stoneskin becomes a hindrance not worth even considering between battles. The spell takes 3 seconds to cast and quite frankly, from what we've seen so far, your party isn't going to want to bother even waiting for you to cast more than one between battles while this spell is constantly broken off each member of your party during battle.

If SE desired to make this spell a nice application before battle that we couldn't replace in the midst of it, then why is it so weak and dependent on our targets HP? Why is it not an AoE like Protect? Why not just make it a steady 10% damage reduction that automatically replenish its worth between battles or some other similar effect that lets us not have to worry about reapplying it so often?

The spell is currently in a state of not knowing what the hell it wants to accomplish. It's like it wants to be like the old versions of Stoneskin, but it's too weak to be considered that useful. Some insist on its usefulness before battles, but then why does it constantly need attention before even the smallest of skirmishes? Why is it so weak that members of our party who do not possess the highest of HP get the weakest returns?

Keep in mind that it's MP cost during battle does limit its usefulness that casting it during battle on anything but a WAR make its use wasteful. On a WAR however, you're essentially applying an additional 1K+ HP for a MP cost that is actually rather effective (the MP cost was acceptable during P3). How is it right that only one job within the game actually change the rules on how this spell works? Topaz Carbuncle will probably end up benefiting even more from this spell than the WAR by the time it's level 50.

is Holy scaling off INT like others damage spells or MND ?

It scales off INT I believe. Cleric Stance seemed to confirm this during P3.

Well I was wondering if only Cnj/Whm can raise during a battle. Since that's what the level28 passive suggests. So in a tougher fight the PT is better with two Whm instead of Whm + Sch?

No, both can be cast during battle, however SCH and ACN get away with not wasting a trait having to do so. WHM is instead forced to share their version just so other classes can equip the same spell but receive a lesser version of it while we need a stupid trait to receive what SCH and ACN get by default.

Im just gonna go ahead and make a prediction: If nothing is done about WHM/SCH balance, world first Bahamut and Primals Extreme whatever will be done with 2 SCH and no WHM, because there simply isnt any reason to use WHM right now

I don't see it being quite as bad as you predict, but I do agree with your general assessment.

White Mage will become 2nd rate in comparison to an experienced and effective Scholar but still maintain a necessity in some battles as they possess a greater ability to heal whole groups thanks to Medica.

your proposed aero change would make fey light on the scholar, useless.

Ah, thanks, I didn't realize that.

I've changed Aero to still suit the whole "Haste" image I tried to give it, but not compete with Scholar's "Fey Light".

How much it can heal over x amount of time is irrelevant; it's there to recover from mistakes or abnormal situations. If the tank is sitting at 10-15% hp and a big attack is coming, the only thing that matter is how much health you can dump on him or her in <2 seconds. Benediction is clearly superior.

One is not better than the other in this case. They both have their advantages and disadvantages.

Over a period of time, Lustrate will see more use and be more useful in general, but you can't deny that just having Benediction available could make the presence of a WHM invaluable for sudden spike damage.

The real question is, does Lustrate consume no MP like Benediction? Or is it considered a spell like Cure?

If Lustrate consumes no MP, then it's use and consumption of Aetherflow will be absolutely amazing for SCH and enhance their ability to maintain max MP through even the longest prolonged battles. WHM will have nothing in comparison. Whether that becomes an issue or not, we still have yet to find out.

Scholars get Aetherflow and Carbies, while White Mages are left with only Freecure/Overcure (which I do like).

They don't get Carby at all actually.
And are you saying you like the way Freecure/Overcure currently work? Or the idea behind them? Because right now, Freecure is a broken mess (or it was the last time I tested it) and Overcure you'll be able to take advantage of maybe once every blue moon.

Where do you get Cura and Sacred Prism? I don't know where to go for these Quested spells.

Cura = Cure II

I only choose those names because I think Cura, Water, and Watera are far more fitting than Fluid Aura and Cure II.

You get Cure II at level 30 though. Sacred Prism however was removed entirely from the game and you won't ever see that again unless they add it beyond level 50.

Those are just spells that the OP made up in an effort to make a WHM spell list more to his/her tastes.

Actually Sacred Prism, Cura, and Blessed Mind use to be in 1.23

[Kowru]

No, both can be cast during battle, however SCH and ACN get away with not wasting a trait having to do so. WHM is instead forced to share their version just so other classes can equip the same spell but receive a lesser version of it while we need a stupid trait to receive what SCH and ACN get by default.

How do you know this? To my knowledge nobody was able to test resurrection in ß4 and the tool tips read literally the exact same. How can you just assume that ACN raise can be used in battle when nobody was able to use it?

[Maldalewyn]

How do you know this? To my knowledge nobody was able to test resurrection in ß4 and the tool tips read literally the exact same. How can you just assume that ACN raise can be used in battle when nobody was able to use it?

They don't read exactly the same. Look at them more closely.

Resurrection by default states nothing about an inability to be used in battle, yet it has no traits that would make this possible either. It's able to do this by default is why.

Raise on the other hand, when you first acquire it reads like this:

Resurrects target to a weakened state.
Cannot be used to raise targets in battle.

The only reason this changes later on, and is not shown this way on xivdb, which is where I assume you're looking, is because of the trait we acquire.

xivdb is really annoying about that. It displays trait bonuses for every skill as if they were present.



EDIT:

Go HERE if you want to see what I mean.
Flip the switch and change the "Main" to "Sub" and you'll see Raise in it's default form. If Resurrection worked this way, it would read the same way.

[Kowru]

Right I get what you're saying. But just because it doesn't mention explicitly you cannot use it in battle does not mean you can just assume it'll be usable in battle. But you're right, I misread that in db. I'm just trying to say, we should wait on jumping the gun on things until the game is fully released and can be fully tested.

Edit:

At 22 ACN, it'll be the first thing I do, literally.