PS2 Limitations: What are Rumors, What is Truth?

[Gwynplaine]

Ever since the last update triggered a glitch in the PS2 to react as though the HDD was full, rumors and speculation about its limitations have flared up. Some limitations like the auto translate memory has been acknowledge by Square, but otherwise it's difficult for any casual player to tell what is true or just a rumor. I wasn't sure where to put this, I'm addressing it like a Twitter question but I don't know if any forum reps will be interested in suggesting answers.

Here are the most common rumors I hear players talk about:

Rumor 1-The PS2 HDD capacity is nearly full. Or, the maximum partition space a single PS2 HDD game can use up is 8GB which FFXI is nearing. The partition limit sounds like it could be realistic. If it were I don't know how much trouble it could be to expand further or if it's possible. If partition space isn't an issue then I doubt HDD space really is an issue.

Rumor 2-There's a hard coded limit built into FFXI on how many zones the game can index. This sounds unlikely to me and I've never seen any solid info.

Rumor 3-A large population of Japanese players still use the PS2 for playing FFXI. Was this ever, or is it now still true? Something you hear a lot and it feels possible, but no real solid info.

Hopefully this at least helps communicate the popular gossip players are passing around. I'd appreciate any helpful info that could be provided.

[rog]

#1 is true, but can be changed.

#2 is also true, but unless there is not even a single free byte left in ram, can also be changed.

#3 was definitely true in the past, and probably still is, but not 100% sure.

edit: apparently #2 has already been fixed.

[Dsherman]

Here is my own rumor (unconfirmed) about that glitch that said the PS2 HDD was full on the Update that occurred December 6,2010........ SE Botched something on the preliminary update they made available on November 30.

There was no Server downtime on November 30. So people already running the game were not forced to exit and receive the November 30 update.

It is my belief that anyone that just kept the game running the whole time, plus anyone that just simply didn't try to play FFXI from November 30 until December 6 had no problem with the December 6 update. Those of use that did receieve the November 30 update got that error and had to do the "Clean Install" to get the December 6 update to work.

If this were true, SE probably overlaid the bad data as they set up the December 6 update..all before anyone knew there was a problem.

I have received NO confirmation of this from SE.... it is only my own personal experience. But it is plausable.

[Delsus]

Here is my own rumor (unconfirmed) about that glitch that said the PS2 HDD was full on the Update that occurred December 6,2010........ SE Botched something on the preliminary update they made available on November 30.

There was no Server downtime on November 30. So people already running the game were not forced to exit and receive the November 30 update.

It is my belief that anyone that just kept the game running the whole time, plus anyone that just simply didn't try to play FFXI from November 30 until December 6 had no problem with the December 6 update. Those of use that did receieve the November 30 update got that error and had to do the "Clean Install" to get the December 6 update to work.

If this were true, SE probably overlaid the bad data as they set up the December 6 update..all before anyone knew there was a problem.

I have received NO confirmation of this from SE.... it is only my own personal experience. But it is plausable.

The only way this would be possible is if PC users also downloaded the bad data, a prelimenery update adds DATs but they sit inactive until an activation code is added to them so playing the game without these DATs should cause no issues.

About the rumors, I beleave the issue with the PS2 hard drive is that the ffxi partition is the issue, which is why SE decided to change it so that it deleted the old DATs before installing the others, this action by SE proves that the ffxi partition is the issue here.

There isnt a limit of zones in ffxi, the limit is in the PS2's RAM, it only has 32MB which is pathetic for todays standards, all they could do is try to make a type of page filing to get round this problem, but I dont know how easy that would be.

however I cant say the exact numbers of japanese playing on the PS2 but as far as I beleve is that the Japanese prefer to play on consoles rather than PC which would enforce the argument that the main japanese playerbase plays on PS2

[Gwynplaine]

Hmm, interesting responses. It would be great if someone at Square could address some of these at some point. Because as you can see from a lot of other threads it turns into hysteria about the PS2 ending the game etc. when they may not know what they're talking about.

I'm not sure about that "bad data" notion. The way Square made it sound was like the method PS2 was downloading new updates made it think like it was using up/downloading twice the amount of stuff it really was. So it acted like it was full.

[Kaosis]

It's kinda funny and strange that PS2 is still considered so strictly. If any player now were to try to play FFXI on PS2 they can't. The only currently in use model is thin and has no HDD. The PS2 game is also very hard to find if at all. And PS3 doesnt support PS2 games anymore and it is not on PSN. If they were to drop support for PS2 and make it downloadable for PSN in some fashion then PS2 limitations will be no more. Might become 360 limitations afterwards :P

[Futan]

[...]

#2 is also true, but unless there is not even a single free byte left in ram, can also be changed.

[...]

edit: apparently #2 has already been fixed.

Kind of curious where you got the source code to know that the supposed area limit is hard coded? Hard coded, of course, meaning it's in the source code opposed to an external .DAT. And that's something that would only need to be loaded into memory upon changing zones, while a bunch of other much more memory intensive things are being unloaded from memory, so there should be no issue with memory that causes an area limit.

[Lilsanchez]

They did fix it to an extend. Earlier SE let the PS2 house a bunch of junk files that where completely unessisary anymore. Just remove all of them and you probably instantly have at least a gig of freespace. They made it so it gets rid of the junk files now dont it?

In any case, I really hate how they are limiting the PCs gameplay because of the PS2. They really should make different installments of the gamen for PS2 and other systems. Might even persuade PS2 players to move away from the dark ages of PS2.

[bungiefan]

It's kinda funny and strange that PS2 is still considered so strictly. If any player now were to try to play FFXI on PS2 they can't. The only currently in use model is thin and has no HDD. The PS2 game is also very hard to find if at all. And PS3 doesnt support PS2 games anymore and it is not on PSN. If they were to drop support for PS2 and make it downloadable for PSN in some fashion then PS2 limitations will be no more. Might become 360 limitations afterwards :P

PS2 FFXI and the HDD are still in print in Japan, as are non-slim PS2s last time I checked the Japanese PlayStation.com store. Compatible PS3s are globally discontinued though.

Japan had a lot of HDD support in games, and they got the HDD in 2001. Sony of Japan couldn't just discontinue it, especially with most Japanese online games charging a monthly fee on PS2. Nobunaga's Ambition Online, Final Fantasy XI, Front Mission Online, Net de Bomberman, Minna no Golf Online, both Resident Evil Outbreaks, and probably a few games I'm missing required the HDD (Resident Evil Outbreak merely used the HDD if present and let you join games where others were using the HDD), and all had a monthly fee to play in Japan.

Meanwhile, SCEA stripped out HDD support from a bunch of games that got brought over, and delayed the HDD release until 2004, only to discontinue it a few months later, because there wasn't a lot of pressure here from games requiring it.

The game launched on PS2 in Japan, with a PC version being released 6+ months later, and the PS2 version has been constantly in print in Japan, with yearly collections on disc for PS2 until at least 2008. It's always been easy for them to get it.

EDIT: So I checked for a link to provide, and I guess they finally stopped selling model 50000 non-slims in Japan, and the HDD is no longer listed on the Japanese site for order. At least I can't find it with the current layout. Still, it took them much longer to do so. I was able to order one after WotG released.

http://www.jpbutton.com/?page_id=3113

Elmer, the guy who runs that site, lives in Japan. The HDD and compatible PS2s were still on shelves new in 2009 there. The information he collected then said ~30% of JP players were on PS2 then.

[Zackan]

So thats the reason why its so hard to drop ps2.

Aside from the fact that the japanese dont want it dropped.. its because this is a PS2 game, ported over to the PC and 360

By dropping the ps2 they are gonna drop the Core design of the game.