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  1. #31
    Player blowfin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    440
    Character
    Blowfin
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    COR Lv 90
    I have yet to see trials for Ridill or Perdu Voulge, both of which BTW, required more effort then getting a relic.
    Id personally assume that a large amount of people put in very minimal effort to get the Voulgue actually. It didnt get released until quite late in the Assault picture, and if you played with any frequency you were 5 or maybe 10 assaults from ranking up and having it when the patch got released. For a lot of people it was probably purely incidental.
    (0)

  2. #32
    Player Atomic_Skull's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,248
    Character
    Bjorne
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    MNK Lv 5
    Quote Originally Posted by wish12oz View Post
    wall-o-text
    I'd wager that Caladbolg most certainly is good outside Abyssea.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3a8fNhA2Pw

    It's merely average inside Abyssea but outside it becomes grossly overpowered specifically because it doesn't rely on critical hit atmas to be good. I've seen DRK/WARs (SAM isn't really that useful for DRK anymore after the last update) throwing out 2k+ Torcleavers regularly outside Abyssea.

    Ukko's does 1500-2k outside Abyssea.

    Apoc is better than Redemption but again, Caladbolg makes both of them garbage.

    Almace is good outside Abyssea *if* you have a WS set. You can't just full time your turtle PLD gear like you can with lolatonement. Regardless PLD is the second most useless job in FFXI right now so which weapon is better for them is largely irrelevant because nobody should be bringing a PLD to anything anyway.

    RNG sucks, period, it doesn't matter what they use. The job is so irrelevant in 2011 that they might as well just delete it at this point so Gandiva vs Yoichi is a pointless discussion.

    And LOL at taking less damage when WHM exists. Only one thing matters in 2011 for heavy DD and that is how much damage you do.


    EDIT: It is also suspected (but not proven yet) that Ukko's and Blade: Hi have a cRatio bonus like Y/G/K and Spinning Slash due to their consistent high damage on HNM.
    (0)
    Last edited by Atomic_Skull; 05-26-2011 at 07:27 PM.

  3. #33
    Player Sargent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    San d'Oria
    Posts
    281
    Character
    Sargent
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Like you, I was working on Nirvana, but kinda gave up. However, since I read on dev tracker somewhere that SE are going to reduce the difficulty in obtaining Relics and Mythics, I've restarted. Don't forget they added Cat's Eye in this update that was dat mined to suggest that it is in fact 30k Alexandrite, they may add that as a PW drop or something.
    It would be nice for an actual announcement on it, however. Drites are one thing, but they really should increase the drop rate on T4 trophies too, especially considering the effort you have to put in to obtain a T4 pop.
    (0)
    SMN99/SAM99/DNC99/PLD99/THF99
    Summoning magic skill: 545
    Hvergelmir 90

  4. #34
    Player JiltedValkyrie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Windurst
    Posts
    149
    Character
    Yuusaku
    World
    Lakshmi
    Main Class
    BRD Lv 99
    Let ID Tags accumulate over time like traverser stones/voidstones and let us go into Salvage solo with quickly respawning mobs not unlike current Dynamis. Let every mob drop alexandrite instead of only gears. At least triple or quadruple the ichor output in Einhejar. Even with all of this, it would still take months to complete a mythic, so I don't see why not.

    Some of us don't care about the stats so much as we like the look of a particular weapon. Well, I'm also a DD BRD, and Carnwenhan is so much nicer looking that that really ugly Twashtar. Also working on a Mandau simultaneously.
    (1)

  5. #35
    Player nitsuj's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    24
    Character
    Framerate
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    It was suggested on Bluegartr that Cat's Eye is just a mog bonanza prize, and the dats point towards handing it in completes the quest, but does not return any of your existing alexandrite

    But again, some confirmation would be awesome.
    (0)

  6. #36
    Player
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    352
    Quote Originally Posted by wish12oz View Post
    And by your standards, they should make everything awesome even though there's new content. I want my Perdu volge, ridill, etc, etc, etc to be amazing again, cause the relic people are getting updated, so why not my stuff I put all that time and effort into getting? See the problem here? You should be happy you got magian trials and just be content already.
    a perdu voulge is not a relic
    (0)

  7. #37
    Player Arciel's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    139
    Character
    Arciele
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    I too would like to hear some response from the dev team on this matter.
    At the moment I'm going for the exact same mythic as Nitsuj, but I'd wager I'm not as far along.

    My qualms about mythic weapons is something that the dev team already seems familiar with, but I'd like to highlight them even further.

    I get the feeling that the dev team wants to make Relic, Mythic and Empyrean weapons on-par options for top-tier weapons, which is why they all have Magian Trials to improve them past their original form. I like the notion of this, except that there is a severe imbalance between Relics, Mythics and Empyrean weapons - and this was present even before
    Empyreans were introduced.

    Let me do a comparison of the 3, with my opinion of a scale of 1-10, the required (cannot be substituted by doing other things) effort for Relic weapons and the Gil-value of costs involved are like this.

    Relic Weapons, of the 3, are the easiest to obtain for anyone with a lot of gil. You basically accumulate enough gil to purchase Dynamis currency or farm it yourself - the option is readily available for players until you have enough to fund the relic. There are a total of 2 distinct NMs to kill (albeit repeated depending on drop rate) and they are not deemed hard anymore, especially with the changes to Dynamis. Some effort is required again after acquiring the 75 weapon to improve it through the trials.
    Effort: 3/10 Cost: 8/10

    Empyrean Weapons are currently the easiest to make, and the cheapest. You have to kill 3-8 of a number of NMs along the way before the real grind of obtaiin 50 items from 1 NM, then another 50, and then 75 from another NM. But these NMs are not hard - especially given our current player levels and Atma system, so the process is more of a slow grind than anything. That said, you could easily grind through 50 drops of the NM within a week with the help of some friends or help others who need the NM kill but not that specific drop.
    Effort: 6/10 Cost 0/10

    Mythic Weapons however are a torturous process for the patient. Firstly, you need to clear all Aht Urhgan missions, which is not hard if you like to do them already, climb to Floor 100 on Nyzul Isle and clear all 50 Assault missions before even being able to start the first real step towards getting a Mythic. From there, clearing every Salvage, Einherjar Odin, and the 3 Beastmen leaders. This process alone already requires more effort than a Relic already needs. And because of the nature of Assault missions and Nyzul Isle being based on tags, you will need to take a few months to get them all cleared.

    If you can accomplish that, then the insanity begins. Redoing all 50 Assault missions, repeating Einherjar until you get 100,000 ichor, repeating Nyzul Isle until you get 150,000 tokens, and THEN obtaining 30,000 Alexandrite, which either requires repeating Salvage (which requires repeating Assault for points to enter Salvage) or buying it to save you the hassle. Either way, you're looking at months upon months of committed effort to events that need to be repeated, some of which require sizable groups to attempt.

    Before Empyreans came out, I'd say I was willing to put up with it because the weapon was worth it, but when other players can get a weapon which is just as good, or even better by putting in so much less, I think it is a little unfair.

    Anyway, theres still doing Zeni NMs for the Tier 4 NM trophies, which are still NOT 100%. Players barely have a reason to do this - and the effort put in is already this immense, but they have to go through yet another round of luck on drops. And once you have that, there is an easy BC to do, but if for whatever reason you fail (d/c maybe?) you will have to repeat this last step. BUT THATS NOT THE END, because there are magian trials now. What you will have at this point is only a weapon worthy at Lv75, not 90 or 99. The effort put in from this point is about the same as Relic weapons, but bear in mind we've already had to do so much more along the way before reaching this point.

    Mythic Weapons
    Effort: 10/10 Cost: 7/10

    I know this may seem like a very long rant, but I would really love to hear the developers take on this - it may well determine if I will continue this arduous process to obtain a good weapon (by the way, as a Summoner, the Mythic weapon far surpasses Relic or Empyrean, so its not like I can just go for the easier alternative) or press on.

    We've seen that you've already eased Relic weapons obtainment difficulty by changing Dynamis, but that must only be the start - the Mythics have yet to see changes that would lower their difficulty to a level comparable with Empyrean weapons.

    I have some suggestions.

    "Stage 1"
    Captain Rank, Runic Key, Vigil Weapon - this does not need to change.

    "Stage 2" - An Imperial Heist
    Obtaining the 8 NM titles - I find this to still be a fair course to undertake

    "Stage 3" - Duties, Tasks and Deeds
    Balrahn's Eyepatch - 100,000 Therion Ichor
    Wyrmseeker of Areuhat - 150,000 Nyzul Tokens
    30,000 Alexandrite
    Redoing all 50 Assault missions

    This quest is the extreme one. Something needs to be done here to tone down the time / effort required, or the cost involved. I have 2 suggestions for this.

    1) Make the quest require only 2 of the 4 paths to be undertaken. Effort put into any 2 of the 4 quests at its present state could be comparable to an Empyrean weapon right now. This also allows players to choose the path that they wish to undertake, to find one where the effort required suits their tastes.

    2) Lower the overall requirements. I think it is unrealistic to expect you to scrap Alexandrite completely, but it feels very out of place considering there should be a balance of effort required to cost required - whereas this quest goes overboard on both counts. I would suggest lowering the amount of ichor required, lowering the number of tokens required, possibly lowering the number of assault logs required to be completed to just 1, and most importantly, lowering the alexandrite required to a mere fraction of its current amount.

    "Stage 4" - Forging a New Myth
    Tinnin's Fang, Tyger's Tail, Sarameya's Hide - this needs adjusting as well.

    The Zeni NM system is not very popular anymore, so it is hard to get people to do this. One of the biggest things holding people back is the zeni point system, gained by trading soul plates to Sanraku, which once again, requires effort to do. IF you're able to clear the system, another obstacle blocks you, that being the droprate on these 3 items, so I see 2 adjustments that can be made here.

    1 - lower the Zeni cost for purchasing triggers from Sanraku OR increasing the point value of soulplates traded to him

    2 - raising trophy drops to 100% (this needs to be done)

    Anything beyond this point may require effort but is nothing compared to what comes before, and by then you at least have a Lv75 Mythic weapon to use and show for it.

    ...so if you can please take the considerations of Mythic upgraders in mind, do give us an idea of what to expect in terms of bringing the difficulty of Mythics down to par with Empyrean weapons. Also, the last thing we'd want to do is put in unnecessary effort if you were going to fix something that would mean we would no longer need to invest the energy into it.

    ***
    for the record I am currently on Duties, Tasks and Deeds and already obtained the Eyepatch and Book, but am still working on the other 2 paths.
    (2)

  8. #38
    Community Rep Camate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,712
    Currently the development team is not looking at adjusting the amount of alexandrite needed, nor are they looking into increasing the methods by which alexandrite can be obtained. However, they will be making improvements and adjustments in order to rejuvenate salvage, assault, and other Treasures of Aht Urghan content.
    (13)
    Devin "Camate" Casadey - Community Team

  9. #39
    Player Leonlionheart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Jeuno
    Posts
    1,769
    Character
    Leonlionheart
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    WAR Lv 95
    Quote Originally Posted by Camate View Post
    Currently the development team is not looking at adjusting the amount of alexandrite needed, nor are they looking into increasing the methods by which alexandrite can be obtained. However, they will be making improvements and adjustments in order to rejuvenate salvage, assault, and other Treasures of Aht Urghan content.
    Well this would indeed fix the problem to some extent, assuming salvage gear is on par/ better than AF3

    @Atomic_Skull: IDK what Ukko WAR you're playing with, but I commonly get 3~3.8k outside with Ukko's. You just need to bump up dDEX and crit rate more to make sure you're critting, in which case blood rage and af3+2 feet will cause Ukko's to still rape every other WS outside, even though it always will because of WS frequency (assuming you have a BRD). Only way anyone else will beat WAR outside is caladbolg DRK w/o BRD using desperate blows, which will definitely out do WAR w/o marches.
    (1)

  10. #40
    Player Arciel's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    139
    Character
    Arciele
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    thank you. at least hearing something specific about one of the bigger issues with mythic weapons helps mythic upgraders to chart their plans
    (0)

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