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  1. #11
    Player hakrev's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Posts
    26
    Character
    Hakrev
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    WAR Lv 99
    Only in abyssea....that's all we have to do these days and that is the only thing for anyone 75+, i don't see other jobs struggling with the simple act of casting the right spell at the right time and being forced to sit there and do nothing because people don't want you to cast the wrong spell and ruin the yellow proc. They gave us blm spells and we should totally be allowed to use those spells how we want to.
    (0)

  2. #12
    Player hakrev's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    26
    Character
    Hakrev
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    WAR Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Lushipur View Post
    thing is, scanner (attach or built is) should see if a mob is immune/absorb or triggered by a spell and avoid it.
    Yes it should, but instead it makes our auto stop casting anything alot of the time...another thing that really needs fixing.
    (0)

  3. #13
    Player Drac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    28
    Character
    Draconious
    World
    Quetzalcoatl
    Main Class
    PUP Lv 99
    As a Career PUP the only truly viable option is to make separate timers on Cures and -na spells. Their are times where silena, paralyna or stona will get shadows back up, which can be much more valuable.
    PUPs also have a fair number of options for Hp and MP restoration, the spells Drain, Aspir, and Aspir II can be removed from the matons spell list with little to no repercussions.

    Their are alot of other issues with matons but these are the two that everyone can agree needs to be changed
    (0)

  4. #14
    Player hakrev's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    26
    Character
    Hakrev
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    WAR Lv 99
    Yes that will solve the whm puppet AI, but we need to think broader then that, that will do nothing to solve our Blm puppets casting the wrong spells. Scanner seeing if a spell has been triggered is a great idea and deffinately should be implemented, but having a blue mage style selecetion to make a spell list and allowing the automaton to chose from those spells would literally fix all of our mage AI problems. Blm would stop double procing yellow, whm would stop casting blindna when you're about to die etc.
    (0)

  5. #15
    Player Kayn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Sandy
    Posts
    40
    Character
    Khayn
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    PUP Lv 92
    Quote Originally Posted by Anza View Post
    Dear FFXI development team,

    Puppetmasters appreciate the increased attention given to our job since the beginning of 2010, after several years of feeling that PUP was a neglected job. Because we feel that the current development team is paying more attention to the players in general, and the PUP job in particular, we would like to bring to the attention of the dev team several key issues that the English-speaking PUP community has struggled with for a long time. These are not just my concerns, but an attempt to clearly voice some longstanding issues from many in the community. Your consideration of these issues would be greatly appreciated.

    (1) Mage puppet AI.
    Likely the most widespread complaint within the English-speaking PUP community. Despite the former development team suggesting that all was working as intended, the PUP community generally dislikes the Soulsoother head's priorities forcing a status removal spell over a cure whenever the master or puppet has a status effect (no way to force a Cure VI over Blindna when the master is at 50hp is not very helpful!). Many monsters that seem perfectly in line with what a PUP with adequate control over the automaton could solo become highly impractical, and usefulness of the automaton in parties is also compromised.

    In addition, the high automaton HP/MP thresholds for Spiritreaver head choosing to cast Drain/Aspir is a problem for PUPs using that head. This becomes a very big issue when fighting targets where Aspir or Drain are ineffective - the puppet will cast Aspir and get a tiny amount of MP back, meaning that as soon as it can cast Aspir again it will do so and waste a cast. PUPs need a way to override this behavior and force the automaton to not cast Drain/Aspir (just as we have a way to avoid Absorb-INT, simply don't use a Dark Maneuver)

    How about some AI modifications? Some possible suggestions:
    a)Maneuvers.
    Make Soulsoother head only use -na spells on the master and itself when a water maneuver is active (the same current prerequisite for the automaton to use those spells on other party members). For Spiritreaver, only allow Drain/Aspir when a dark maneuver is active (same condition as Absorb-INT).

    b) Attachments.
    Make an attachment modify the normal priorities. For example, with Damage Gauge equipped, Soulsoother will prioritize Cure spells above all else. Or make this an opportunity for Tactical Processor to do something useful.

    c) Adjustments to default priorities.
    Simply change the default priorities. Make the automaton always choose a cure above a -na spell, or adjust the threshold for casting Aspir or Drain (lower automaton MP/HP level).

    d) Separate spell timers for Cure/-na.
    Instead of operating on the shared spell timer for all spells, break status removal spells out on their own unique timer. This way the puppet can still cast Blindna, Paralyna, Poisona, etc., but that cast will not mean a long wait for the spell recast timer for an opportunity to cast that needed Cure.
    There is a possible argument that the PUP can take steps to avoid the pitfalls of quirky automaton AI priorities. For example, to avoid the vicious cycle of automaton focusing only on status removal, the master can stay out of range of nasty enemy abilities as well as keep puppet at a distance. However, forcing the player to take these drastic actions to avoid AI priorities that seem non-sensible does seem to be an unnecessary limitation on the players.

    (2) Weaponskill priority.
    The system by which automaton weaponskills are triggered by a particular dominant maneuver is becoming cumbersome, and will become even more of a burden with new automaton weaponskills that PUPs hope are coming in the journey to level 99. In addition, some weaponskills simply get in the way (mage puppets with high HP, like Soulsoother which cures itself, become useless with vital light maneuvers since they will use the undesirable Magic Mortar). PUPs need to hold back and use otherwise useless dark maneuvers to trigger desired WS on Valoredge (Cannibal Blade) and Sharpshot (Armor Piercer) frames. Perhaps it is time to adjust this aspect of the job.

    One suggestion is a simple menu - perhaps accessed through an NPC similar to the Rendezvous Point menu (changing Fellowship NPC job, use of area of effect WS, etc.) This NPC could allow the PUP to program the automaton to choose appropriate WS for the master's liking, or even set "trigger" maneuvers as chosen by the player for each automaton WS. This "Automaton Adjuster" NPC could even be expanded to address the spellcasting AI issues described above.

    (3) Tactical Processor.
    The PUP community has done testing for years and cannot figure out what this attachment does. Can the dev team explain this item, or adjust it? The community believes this item to either be not working as intended, have such an unusual use that it has not been discovered, or that the attachment is simply useless/nearly useless. Perhaps a change could be made to give this attachment more utility.

    We appreciate your attention and hope to continue a more open dialogue with the dev team.

    Sincerely,

    The PUPs of Vana'diel
    100% support as you already know.

    excellent anza, way to go. hopefully we can have an official answer to this very well written letter.
    (1)

  6. #16
    Player Ramenuzumaki's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    San d'Oria
    Posts
    37
    Character
    Ramenuzumaki
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    THF Lv 99
    I definitely agree with this post!

    Ramenuzumaki of Odin!
    (0)
    Last edited by Ramenuzumaki; 03-09-2011 at 06:56 AM.

  7. #17
    Player xbobx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    575
    Character
    Shuffles
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    PUP Lv 99
    I don't think anyone mentioned the problems with Cures. Have the Whm puppet use appropriate cure. Puppet already understands threasholds and how much hp/mp extra so can we have it stop using Cure 6 when i only need 300 hp. So much wasted mp.

    there must be a way this can be handled better.
    (0)

  8. #18
    Player Drac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    28
    Character
    Draconious
    World
    Quetzalcoatl
    Main Class
    PUP Lv 99
    Guys Lets please stick to the topic of the OP, We need to send a clear message to SE on the biggest issues.

    Mage Frame Matons need AI Fix being the top of the list.

    Lets be honest, Ashu Talif is not that hard @ lvl 90, and SE has given us Deus Ex making MP a non issue.
    (0)

  9. #19
    Player
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    48
    Quote Originally Posted by hakrev View Post
    Another large concern that many pups are having problems with is not being able to adequately control the nukes our puppets cast. Lets say my party triggers yellow with blizzard V, my auto continues to cast blizzard V and thus I get yelled at by my party for something i can't really control
    Just wanted to point out that T5 nukes can't proc yellow so this is a non-issue. I do however agree that we should have more control over the spells it uses. Like reprogramming it similar to how we put attachments in.
    (1)

  10. #20
    Player
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    83
    the healing priority should be like this:
    Cure 30-40% > -na > Cure 60-70%
    you see, if it was only Cure > -na there is a very high chnace that the AI will get stuck on cure without casting a single -na even when you are safe, I faced this issue when i was trying to build my healing gambit in FFXII, It can be different though or not needed here, but this method of AI healing is the most logical way I can think of and work perfectly in other games.
    (0)

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