How can SE make the Redmage frontline job?

[Dale]

RDM can do Front line as long as they don't "SUCK"

in other words............. Keep PT Alive (HEAL) , ENFEEBLE enemy , Buff PT , Dispell enemy , Nuke Enemy.

Keep all those up + DD

I myself and several other RDM in my LS manage to do that (you won't have a SINGLE Second to Rest , however that is what RDM is all about........ ^^ Have fun)

I guess it depends what you mean when you say front line. If you mean that to be tanking - then I think that complicates our ability to use all our resources. But I do think we can make decent make-shift tanks.

If you mean it to say melee then I concur. I think the job already has all the tools it needs to melee and function as an effective support job at the same time. So I think SE has done a really good job at re-tooling this class into being an actual fighter/mage.

[Kuroganashi]

I guess it depends what you mean when you say front line. If you mean that to be tanking - then I think that complicates our ability to use all our resources. But I do think we can make decent make-shift tanks.

If you mean it to say melee then I concur. I think the job already has all the tools it needs to melee and function as an effective support job at the same time. So I think SE has done a really good job at re-tooling this class into being an actual fighter/mage.

I see way too many noob RDM that want to DD and end up never healing or doing their proper job, I don't have a problem with a RDM in Front Line, however I expect them to do their job 100% that is all I am saying.

SEI made RDM Tough enough they can solo NMs and even Survive some of the 119 shit

I seen a RDM Tank Delve BOSS np !

I seen RDM Tank Unity NM also w/o dying or losing any major HP !

I seen a RDM Do shit that ppl would go WILD if they could (I.E. solo VW Shit , Unity , Delve NMs)

it is all about how you play it. and how much you are used to it.

I personally use Shield / Sword

But I been seeing RDM/DNC trying to do shit and fail...... wonder why. :P

[Dale]

I see way too many noob RDM that want to DD and end up never healing or doing their proper job, I don't have a problem with a RDM in Front Line, however I expect them to do their job 100% that is all I am saying.

SEI made RDM Tough enough they can solo NMs and even Survive some of the 119 shit

I seen a RDM Tank Delve BOSS np !

I seen RDM Tank Unity NM also w/o dying or losing any major HP !

I seen a RDM Do shit that ppl would go WILD if they could (I.E. solo VW Shit , Unity , Delve NMs)

it is all about how you play it. and how much you are used to it.

I personally use Shield / Sword

But I been seeing RDM/DNC trying to do shit and fail...... wonder why. :P

Yeah I don't disagree with you. They can accomplish just about any role they want and the job itself has amazing potential and versatility.

I was just trying to point out that it can be difficult to be both tank and support. That's hard to pull off. But we can easily slide into the melee/support role. I think that's where we shine brightest.

[Zekander]

Once again, RDM is not the only job capable of doing those things, and many jobs can do so more effectively. And even if RDM were so divinely perfect as your opinion of it seems to be, that shouldn't stop us from asking for more. Please stop holding the rest of us mortal mages back.

[Protey]

RDM can do Front line as long as they don't "SUCK"

in other words............. Keep PT Alive (HEAL) , ENFEEBLE enemy , Buff PT , Dispell enemy , Nuke Enemy.

Keep all those up + DD

I myself and several other RDM in my LS manage to do that (you won't have a SINGLE Second to Rest , however that is what RDM is all about........ ^^ Have fun)

I disagree with the curing the party part. Assist cure, yes that I would agree with. Main heal? no way, not unless it is designated before hand, and then you aren't going to be meleeing because you're going to have to be in refresh gear and have ballads or some other kind of mp recovery buffs over melee buffs. Obviously if the whm dies, then yes you would take over as main healer, but then you stop meleeing at that point too. It's the same with being backup tank. you stop doing other things to hold the NM while the PLD recovers. This requires that others have a bit of sense though. They need to stop hitting the mob as RDM doesn't have much in the way of hate gaining tools. When in this situation, I would have the WHM stop curing the DDs and the DDs stop hitting. I would cure the DDs until I have hate. Then I turtle up and wait for the PLD to recover.

Also, if you're meleeing, why would you be nuking? I can understand on Laevvid to cast a water nuke every 1000 TP to make it take melee damage, but other than that why would you nuke when meleeing? By definition you can't do them at the same time.

[Demonjustin]

I disagree with the curing the party part.

Also, if you're meleeing, why would you be nuking?

You took the words right outta my mouth. The rest we can cover, but those two are kinda impossible to do while on the front lines, the latter is really more an "either or" rather than an "as well as".

[Dale]

You took the words right outta my mouth. The rest we can cover, but those two are kinda impossible to do while on the front lines, the latter is really more an "either or" rather than an "as well as".

It's not that hard to melee then switch into nuke gear to magic burst off a skill chain for example - which I think is in sync with the job's design. So I don't understand why you don't think Red Mage can nuke while on the front lines. Why can't they?

Even the Red Mage specific sword in Port Jueno has magic damage on it. So I'd say SE intended for the Red Mage to mix it up with melee and elemental magic. Though I'll admit its effectiveness is pretty situational. But most things are.

[Demonjustin]

I admittedly have never tried MBing off of SCs while using my blades, so I can't say how effective it'd be. My issue with nuking while meleeing at all is the fact that I'd never gimp my meleeing that I'll do on every target the entire time simply to increase MB DMG in the event I were to pull them off here and there. Currently so far as weaponry goes I use Excalibur/Buramenk'Ah, neither of which have MDMG, and even once I have my Mythic I'll likely still be without a MDMG weapon.

We have some decent options for MDMG but they require a fairly decent sacrifice of melee damage to the point of which I don't feel it's worth the return. Honestly I wish they put MDMG on a lot more melee weapons, it'd make a strategy like that much more viable, instead right now we have a total of 3 Swords and 1 Dagger that offer MDMG, almost all of which fall quite a bit short of what other weapons offer for simply melee damage. Were that issue fixed, I'd say the issue overall may fall away a bit, but for now it's fairly restricting and to a point of which I just can't see the sacrifice being generally worthwhile.

All of that said, something else that would be nice in that family of thought would be to have an ability to self skillchain. Were we capable of doing that, it'd give more access to this method of nuking while meleeing. Having to rely on a party to do something specific is part of why I'm not sure I'd be willing to make the concessions necessary to get that extra MDMG. Something that would allow us to add skillchain elements to our spells for a single spell every minute or two along the same lines as the SCH JA would be a great fix to that.

[Protey]

All of that said, something else that would be nice in that family of thought would be to have an ability to self skillchain. Were we capable of doing that, it'd give more access to this method of nuking while meleeing. Having to rely on a party to do something specific is part of why I'm not sure I'd be willing to make the concessions necessary to get that extra MDMG. Something that would allow us to add skillchain elements to our spells for a single spell every minute or two along the same lines as the SCH JA would be a great fix to that.

sounds like BLU's Chain Affinity.

[Demonjustin]

Yep, similar to that too. We just need it to be able to make Lv.3s and it'd be fine.