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  1. #11
    Player Alukat's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Posts
    302
    Character
    Alukat
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    THF Lv 99
    idm if other jobs get the TH1 trait
    (0)

  2. #12
    Player Xilk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Windurst
    Posts
    678
    Character
    Xilkk
    World
    Quetzalcoatl
    Main Class
    BST Lv 99
    Wow, please no. BST does not need native dual wield. the idea sounds pretty ridiculous to me. we really don't need it. It really doesn't make sense at all. If you want more dual wield so badly, go play nin.

    I would rather see bst get some native skill w/ archery.
    (0)
    Choh Moui | Rongo-Nango | Lhu Mhakaracca | Lungo-Nango | Nyumomo
    --Beastmaster Forever--

  3. #13
    Player Visari's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    MonstersInc
    Posts
    23
    Character
    Vistaru
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    BST Lv 99
    I would have to agree that bst does not need a native dual wield. /nin and /dnc afford folks plenty of opportunity to dual wield. I personally sub whm in most cases unless i need to hit that -100% pdt. I have to agree with Xilk on the archery. I always found it strange that it is not native to bst and have wondered about that since I began playing.
    (0)

  4. #14
    Player Alukat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    302
    Character
    Alukat
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    THF Lv 99
    why do u want archery? O.o
    /nin or /dnc , remember not everyone is playing solo all time >.>
    (0)

  5. #15
    Player Gotterdammerung's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Yhoator Jungle
    Posts
    325
    Archery would fit so well with beast. Both in playstyle and fluff. Most of the time against big bosses i am just sitting back watching my pet fight and waiting for something to happen. Would be awesome to plink away with arrows insted of being a wallflower.
    (0)

  6. #16
    Player Karbuncle's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Posts
    4,314
    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel_Hatcher View Post
    It's Ninja's job trait, was from more or less day one, whereas Treasure hunter is Thief's. Dancer deserved it on the basis that they have from day one of the job being introduced been depicted with dual daggers, whereas THF never was.

    I play as neither one of the three, but would you like any other job to get Treasure Hunter, I think not. Every job should have their own traits.
    DNC has a Playstyle derived around utilizing Small/Large amounts of TP to perform various buffs, Self Cures, and in itself is one of the most, if not THE most, unique job in the game. Also, all the DNC NPC's in campaign Use h2h, including the big-one, Who uses WS up to Asuran Fists. Something DNC doesn't get. and None of them outside of the leader use Dances. by your logic DNCs don't deserve to use Dances, and should get Asuran fists.

    I'm real sorry if i come off as rude but your reason for THF not deserving Dual Wield while ignoring that DNC has more utility than THF does already, while saying DNC Deserves Dual wield cause its shown as such in Cutscenes is just Illogical to me.

    In my Opinion, if SE has decided to add Dual Wield to the game from Day 1, Who do you think would have gotten it?

    MNK? nope
    WAR? Unlikely, A+ Great Axe
    WHM? nope
    BLM? nope
    RDM? NEWP.
    THF? I think so.

    It just happens that Dual wield wasn't concocted or Introduced until RoTZ, where it was slapped on NIN. To be honest we can't just say THF never deserved Dual wield, Frankly the "old" Dev team was terrible to a fault. They left multiple long-term problems unanswered, Used the term "PS2 Limitations" like it was the new "Cake is a lie" and had almost 0 contact or understanding of the playerbase. If we had our Current Dev-team and their Freedom back then like we do today, I bet THF would have gotten Dual wield at some point.

    Just like it did now (even though its like level 83?).

    Now, Of course we'll never get Dual Wield on THF below 83, They insulted us with Dual Wield 1/2(Probably 3) and they'll likely never change it. But it doesn't change the fact it Should have gotten it from day 1 :|, NINs uniqueness is the Elemental Ninjutsu and Utsusemi(which revolutionized Tanking), it didn't need to hog Dual wield too :|

    I apologize if I've offended or insulted you, I'm just a hard-core THF who really am upset THF has never gotten Dual wield natively at low levels, When it just seems like they logically should have. Especially after DNC was given Dual wield. Its insulting to us as a job. instead we're stuck with Level 83Dual wield1, and Dual Wield II some time between 83~90. (and likely Dual wield III by 99). When we should have gotten Dual wield on the Same Levels/Traits and DNC in the very least.
    (3)
    Last edited by Karbuncle; 04-13-2011 at 08:28 AM.

  7. #17
    Player Daniel_Hatcher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    San d'Oria
    Posts
    2,577
    Character
    Alvian
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    MNK Lv 12
    Quote Originally Posted by Karbuncle View Post
    DNC has a Playstyle derived around utilizing Small/Large amounts of TP to perform various buffs, Self Cures, and in itself is one of the most, if not THE most, unique job in the game. Also, all the DNC NPC's in campaign Use h2h, including the big-one, Who uses WS up to Asuran Fists. Something DNC doesn't get. and None of them outside of the leader use Dances. by your logic DNCs don't deserve to use Dances, and should get Asuran fists.

    I'm real sorry if i come off as rude but your reason for THF not deserving Dual Wield while ignoring that DNC has more utility than THF does already, while saying DNC Deserves Dual wield cause its shown as such in Cutscenes is just Illogical to me.

    In my Opinion, if SE has decided to add Dual Wield to the game from Day 1, Who do you think would have gotten it?

    MNK? nope
    WAR? Unlikely, A+ Great Axe
    WHM? nope
    BLM? nope
    RDM? NEWP.
    THF? I think so.

    It just happens that Dual wield wasn't concocted or Introduced until RoTZ, where it was slapped on NIN. To be honest we can't just say THF never deserved Dual wield, Frankly the "old" Dev team was terrible to a fault. They left multiple long-term problems unanswered, Used the term "PS2 Limitations" like it was the new "Cake is a lie" and had almost 0 contact or understanding of the playerbase. If we had our Current Dev-team and their Freedom back then like we do today, I bet THF would have gotten Dual wield at some point.

    Just like it did now (even though its like level 83?).

    Now, Of course we'll never get Dual Wield on THF below 83, They insulted us with Dual Wield 1/2(Probably 3) and they'll likely never change it. But it doesn't change the fact it Should have gotten it from day 1 :|, NINs uniqueness is the Elemental Ninjutsu and Utsusemi(which revolutionized Tanking), it didn't need to hog Dual wield too :|

    I apologize if I've offended or insulted you, I'm just a hard-core THF who really am upset THF has never gotten Dual wield natively at low levels, When it just seems like they logically should have. Especially after DNC was given Dual wield. Its insulting to us as a job. instead we're stuck with Level 83Dual wield1, and Dual Wield II some time between 83~90. (and likely Dual wield III by 99). When we should have gotten Dual wield on the Same Levels/Traits and DNC in the very least.
    Hardly offended me, we differ on opinions of who should get dual wield. Weaponskills on NM's, NPC's and so on mean very little as doing the Maat fight with RDM puts you against Asurian Fists a move RDM themselves don't even get a chance of getting.

    My point on DNC and being depicted as dual wielding and thus at least deserving some levels of the trait, is that even on the announcement of the job coming to the game they depicted them Dual Wielding, something whether "you'd think THF would get it or not" they never once had.

    THF Was given dual wield in the end along with the new TH as a way to simply try to remove the "Hit the mob once then disengage" method many linkshells and so forth had of thief and their DD capabilities, the same restrictions would have applied to DNC if they didn't require TP to actually be useful.
    (0)

  8. #18
    Player Karbuncle's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Posts
    4,314
    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel_Hatcher View Post
    Hardly offended me, we differ on opinions of who should get dual wield. Weaponskills on NM's, NPC's and so on mean very little as doing the Maat fight with RDM puts you against Asurian Fists a move RDM themselves don't even get a chance of getting.

    My point on DNC and being depicted as dual wielding and thus at least deserving some levels of the trait, is that even on the announcement of the job coming to the game they depicted them Dual Wielding, something whether "you'd think THF would get it or not" they never once had.

    THF Was given dual wield in the end along with the new TH as a way to simply try to remove the "Hit the mob once then disengage" method many linkshells and so forth had of thief and their DD capabilities, the same restrictions would have applied to DNC if they didn't require TP to actually be useful.
    I tried looking up the THF AF Quest, and other things to see if any of them were dual wielding. Even Nanaa_Mihgo in the BCNM.

    Couldn't find SS/Video of THF AF, but Nanaa is Single Wielding. Damnit~ but still, Even if some DNCs are shown Dual Wielding, in Campaign they all use H2H. So its not entirely sound.

    Before DNC I'd be on your side. "/NIN is fine for Dual wield". But the second DNC got Dual Wield IV, My opinion Change. If they were handing out Dual Wield THF shoulda got it too :|

    I mean, They do now, Dual Wield II, Probably DWIII, but still
    (0)

  9. #19
    Player Alukat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    302
    Character
    Alukat
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    THF Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Xilk View Post
    Wow, please no. BST does not need native dual wield. the idea sounds pretty ridiculous to me. we really don't need it. It really doesn't make sense at all. If you want more dual wield so badly, go play nin.

    I would rather see bst get some native skill w/ archery.
    well give BST a DW I and if u need/want DW III do it like now with sub NIN or DNC, i would really like the additional options it would add to advanced gameplay.

    Edit:
    pt example:
    BST/COR pet att+ buffs axes: add effect: eva down*2 (for proc rate)
    BST/COR pet acc+ buffs axes: add effect: def down*2 (for proc rate)
    PUP/DNC (healing duty and pet acc+ increase, if it works on cor sub)
    BST/COR att+ buff or whatever is needed axes: pet att+*2 (as example)
    BST/WHM hasting or BST/BRD for march or whatever, it will benefit the complete pt
    BST/NIN tanking pdt- axe*2

    pt example 2:
    SAM
    THF
    WAR
    DRK
    RDM
    BST/COR (att+ as example) or BST/BRD (march as example)

    at bst/brd with DW I u would lose 15% delay reduction, but overall the pt would get 4% haste to 5 ppl.
    so the BST/BRD would have 10% from DW and 4% from haste. and the thf,sam,drk,war would recieve an additional 4% haste, so the overall dmg output of this pt should be higher as BST/NIN with DW III.
    DW I is neccessary to make this battle tactics work.and u won't lose the increase 2nd axe stats would offer.

    that's why at least DW I for bST yes,please. ^^
    (0)
    Last edited by Alukat; 04-13-2011 at 08:17 PM.

  10. #20
    Player Kensagaku's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    652
    Character
    Kensagaku
    World
    Valefor
    Main Class
    DRG Lv 99
    And as a result you're trying to merge jobs. No. If we need those buffs, we can add a COR to get them at full strength along with another roll rather than getting a gimped roll like /COR provides. Same deal with /BRD; a lesser tier won't help when instead we could get a full BRD, get double Marches and boom, more overall DoT. The argument there is kinda invalid.

    Also you're looking at some really, really specialized builds with that first part that I doubt you'd end up seeing in a party situation. Possible? Oh sure, it is. It'd take some dedication, but it's possible. Probable? Not at all. If anything you're going to get people who look at you, shake their head, and wonder where the traditional party is.

    Not really a good justification for dual-wield for BST.
    (1)
    [Kensagaku - formerly of Kujata] - http://www.ffxiah.com/player/Valefor/Kensagaku

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