The "Good" trusts, when will they be available again

[Vae]

See some people understand, and some don't. It's pretty simple. Yeah you CHOOSE to pay for (insert months item here) or not. But That's a really shit tactic to keep me subbed.

What happens when they make a trust that's actually really good, let's say an exact clone of your account. But you can only have it if you live in Japan.

Yeah, you can move to Japan, that's your choice. But it's pretty stupid right? Yeah, same logic.

If they can't entice you to stay subbed, why be punished for it? It's their fault not ours.

Trust is not a reward. It's not a privilege. It's standard.

And forget a new player starting, there's no good tank available at all. You can't get EV. You can't get August. You can't get Gessho. You can't Ovjang. You can't get Amchuchu. That's absolute nonsense.

[Shiyo]

Tank trusts are completely and utterly useless anytime I use one. I have no idea how anyone makes any use of them, I pull hate the second I use a weapon skill.

I have gessho and ovjang.

[Vae]

You have to play to their style.

Those 2 are the "worst" enmity tanks. Trust setups only really work when you're the mage or the tank or can force hate onto EV/August via Trick.

(and why is that? cause trusts are terrible and have no enmity+ GEAR, no haste+ GEAR, and tbh no stp GEAR)

[Nyarlko]

Are you SERIOUSLY comparing VANITY and COSMETIC items that give ZERO PLAYER POWER to trusts which give PLAYER POWER?

Hello?

To add to this, trusts are new and them being a reward is relatively new as well.

They're at least 2.5yrs old, which is forever ago for most games. That really can't be called "new". The nature and impact for the vast majority of seasonal ciphers is roughly that of seasonal gear nowadays, which is not much. (I remember in the old days, the xmas equip that increased sneak/invis duration was a BIG DEAL when it was first added. XD)

I mean seriously, how often does anyone actually use the goobue at all, much less regularly? >_> How many of the 1-2x a year seasonal trusts are actually toptier for their job/role and are going to see regular use? Any non-login ones besides Moogle/Kupofried? (Genuine question, I really can't think of any others :/) How much "PLAYER POWER" do you gain from something that is no longer used the moment you have ANY other options?

As far as I can tell, the vast majority of ciphers are made available ~4x per year. The extravaganzas are on set schedules w/ set rewards. The login point ones seem to be pretty random, but I could swear that even Shan2 was available at least +2x since she was introduced a year ago. If it was a total of less than 3x, then I'm not sure how I've been able to grab the cipher on all my mules which have been created at different times. O_o;; An average of a 3-4mon of wait-time as a worst case scenario for a new character to get a certain trust simply does not bother me. Probably has something to do with how the overwhelming majority of trusts commonly used in ilvl stuff are mission related, freebies from RoE or the quarterly extravaganzas.

Outside of Kupofried (who the devs are already on record that they absolutely intend to keep limited to 1-2x per year due to his unique ability and wanting to keep him special,) which other trusts are you upset about that are not regularly available and are going to see regular use?

[Vae]

amchuchu, seasonal, best situational tank

Qultada, seasonal, ONLY cor

Aldo, seasonal (yearly) BEST thf trust.

Shantoto II, seasonal, best BLM

Sybil, seasonal, BEST Geo. (not counting moogle and kupofried)

KoH, seasonal, BEST RDM!

Mumor, seasonal, BEST dnc.

Karaha, seasonal, best not-unity healer. only smn, BEST by default (maybe log in, but rare)

ALL THE GOOD TRUSTS ARE SEASONAL.

[Diavolo]

Outside of Kupofried (who the devs are already on record that they absolutely intend to keep limited to 1-2x per year due to his unique ability and wanting to keep him special,) which other trusts are you upset about that are not regularly available and are going to see regular use?

That's a curious stance to take on limited time rewards, downplaying their significance. If you're going to argue that they have little to no practical use, which I would definitely argue as Shantotto II and Amchuchu are still on that list, then couldn't the same argument be made in favor of making them permanent rewards? Someone paying for monthly campaigns/rewards won't feel like they lost any value in their subscription if that monthly reward was useless.

There have been plenty of situations where the long list of competent trusts at my disposal have allowed me to successfully take out content I would have otherwise failed at or needed much more time to defeat, like soloing Azi/Naga/Quetz pre-nerf, where being able to summon a second set of capable characters because my first set was quickly defeated proved very convenient.

The dev team's primary objective should be updating the game to be as appealing and profitable as possible given the limited resources at their disposal and I firmly believe they wouldn't lose a single subscriber if they were to assign the limited time trusts as permanent rewards to existing quests. I actually think it would do more to help the game's appeal than to hurt it. Mounts, costumes and level 1 weapons (looking at you, Master Trials) make far more sense as limited time rewards or even as money shop items if they're ever able to get such a thing up and running for FFXI.

[Nyarlko]

That's a curious stance to take on limited time rewards, downplaying their significance. If you're going to argue that they have little to no practical use, which I would definitely argue as Shantotto II and Amchuchu are still on that list, then couldn't the same argument be made in favor of making them permanent rewards? Someone paying for monthly campaigns/rewards won't feel like they lost any value in their subscription if that monthly reward was useless.

There have been plenty of situations where the long list of competent trusts at my disposal have allowed me to successfully take out content I would have otherwise failed at or needed much more time to defeat, like soloing Azi/Naga/Quetz pre-nerf, where being able to summon a second set of capable characters because my first set was quickly defeated proved very convenient.

The dev team's primary objective should be updating the game to be as appealing and profitable as possible given the limited resources at their disposal and I firmly believe they wouldn't lose a single subscriber if they were to assign the limited time trusts as permanent rewards to existing quests. I actually think it would do more to help the game's appeal than to hurt it. Mounts, costumes and level 1 weapons (looking at you, Master Trials) make far more sense as limited time rewards or even as money shop items if they're ever able to get such a thing up and running for FFXI.

I was not downplaying their significance as much as I was asking which ones other players use. It is possible after all that I just have an entirely different playstyle and/or priorities than anyone else posting in this thread. Since I strongly disagree with several of the entries Vae listed as "bests", that's the assumption I'll roll with now. XD
I use Ullegore as often as Shantotto II since he can use Stun and won't interrupt sc, geo spots usually taken by Moogle & Sakura so no room for SS or Kupofried, avoid using KoH if at all possible due to his aoe mb habit thanks to Arciela II / Koru, Mayakov wrecks Mumor on dmg output, and I've never had good results w/ Karaha due to his desire to melee.

Seems that I was mistaken on the extravaganzas, which makes them make more sense to me now. (Always wondered why the repeated the same event 4x a year. :x) There are two different ones (Spring/Autumn & Winter/Summer) so it is up to a 6mon wait if you just barely miss one. So, outside of Kupofried and the handful tied directly to seasonal events (which are the "holiday" events... login/extravaganzas are not "seasonal") the worst we have to wait is 6mon for any specific trust. Still bearable in my opinion, though I know it may feel like an eternity for the impatient. When I came back last year, I just barely missed the Summer Ext. in July, and had to wait til Jan to stock up. Was disappointed when I found out, but not super upset about it. Figured that now that I gave in to the siren's call and came back to FFXI, I'm gonna be in it til servers go down anyway, so 6mon wasn't really that big a deal for me. lol

[Diavolo]

I was not downplaying their significance as much as I was asking which ones other players use. It is possible after all that I just have an entirely different playstyle and/or priorities than anyone else posting in this thread. Since I strongly disagree with several of the entries Vae listed as "bests", that's the assumption I'll roll with now. XD
[i]I use Ullegore as often as Shantotto II since he can use Stun and won't interrupt sc, geo spots usually taken by Moogle & Sakura so no room for SS or Kupofried, avoid using KoH if at all possible due to his aoe mb habit thanks to Arciela II / Koru, Mayakov wrecks Mumor on dmg output, and I've never had good results w/ Karaha due to his desire to melee.

Iroha II, Shantotto II, Ulmia/Joachim/Qultada, Koru-Moru and Yoran-Oran are the ones I default to in most situations. I'll swap one of them out for August/AA EV/Amchuchu if I happen to need a tank or Ullegore/Robel/Zeid II for stuns. I find Kupo's a waste of a slot when I can kill faster with other trusts in his place. If I happen to be XPing a job from 1 to 99 I almost always go with D. Shantotto, Shantotto II, Ullegore, Robel/Mumor II/Kayeel and Apu/Yoran/Karaha and won't even waste my time with anything below VT as they can easily melt mobs 10-15 levels above you, but I tend to swap one or two of those BLMs out for Iroha II and AA GK when I get around level 50 since an SC + MB will take an IT++ mob out in a few seconds.

Seems that I was mistaken on the extravaganzas, which makes them make more sense to me now. (Always wondered why the repeated the same event 4x a year. :x) There are two different ones (Spring/Autumn & Winter/Summer) so it is up to a 6mon wait if you just barely miss one. So, outside of Kupofried and the handful tied directly to seasonal events (which are the "holiday" events... login/extravaganzas are not "seasonal") the worst we have to wait is 6mon for any specific trust. Still bearable in my opinion, though I know it may feel like an eternity for the impatient. When I came back last year, I just barely missed the Summer Ext. in July, and had to wait til Jan to stock up. Was disappointed when I found out, but not super upset about it. Figured that now that I gave in to the siren's call and came back to FFXI, I'm gonna be in it til servers go down anyway, so 6mon wasn't really that big a deal for me. lol

That's where things differ between those of us logging in daily and the more casual players that might subscribe a few months a year, if that. We're in it for the long haul and log in fairly frequently, if we're short a trust or two it won't be a deal breaker. For someone that doesn't have much time to devote to the game losing out on one of the better trusts can sometimes feel like an insurmountable hurdle when it comes to playing catch up. They get told to do something like collecting a few vorseals by killing some NMs, for example, get told to use August, AA EV or Amchuchu as tanks and when they fail with Gessho or Trion because they don't have access to those three yet things start to look bleak for them.

[Vae]

I was not downplaying their significance as much as I was asking which ones other players use. It is possible after all that I just have an entirely different playstyle and/or priorities than anyone else posting in this thread. Since I strongly disagree with several of the entries Vae listed as "bests", that's the assumption I'll roll with now. XD

See now, we're talking Fact vs Opinion again. There are sub optimal setups and optimal setups. Math isn't an opinion. Situations aren't opinions either.

It's your opinion, but fact is the ones I listed ARE the best, it's not my opinion that they're best.

till bearable in my opinion, though I know it may feel like an eternity for the impatient. When I came back last year, I just barely missed the Summer Ext. in July, and had to wait til Jan to stock up. Was disappointed when I found out, but not super upset about it. Figured that now that I gave in to the siren's call and came back to FFXI, I'm gonna be in it til servers go down anyway, so 6mon wasn't really that big a deal for me. lol

It's also not about "bearable" and "tolerable" it's about "fair" and "realistic". It's literally BUYING certain trusts, by being subscribed certain months. If you take a break due to bordem, you get punished. If you get busy/bored the same time every year, you get severely punished.

[Nyarlko]

See now, we're talking Fact vs Opinion again. There are sub optimal setups and optimal setups. Math isn't an opinion. Situations aren't opinions either.

It's your opinion, but fact is the ones I listed ARE the best, it's not my opinion that they're best.

Not fact. Those are YOUR opinions. ^^ If you are going to try calling someone else out, please ensure you don't make a hypocrite of yourself while doing so. If I was not direct enough, I was trying to agree to disagree because we obviously have very different playstyles so what is best for me may not be best for you (and vv of course.)

It's also not about "bearable" and "tolerable" it's about "fair" and "realistic". It's literally BUYING certain trusts, by being subscribed certain months. If you take a break due to bordem, you get punished. If you get busy/bored the same time every year, you get severely punished.

If you miss buying something during a Black Friday Sale, do you expect to be able to get that product at that price later at your convenience sometime in December? It doesn't really matter why we take a break / unsub for any particular month. SE is a business. If we are not paying customers at the time, we don't get the product offered during that time frame. Makes perfect sense to me.

If getting certain trusts are really important to you, then just make sure you don't miss out next time they roll around. ^^