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  1. #41
    Player Jakuk's Avatar
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    Jul 2016
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    365
    Character
    Jakuk
    World
    Phoenix
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    PUP Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Afania View Post
    A lot of problem with the usefulness of inundation is that when you have 3 DD spam WS every 5 sec they generally don't SC with each other.

    If you hold TP and perform 3 steps then you're losing DPS. If you sacrifice 1 support slot for RDM you lose chaos roll etc.
    Judging by how poor the DMG I've seen some people do, not entirely sure you'd lose DPS performing a 3-step in most parties.
    (0)

  2. #42
    Player Shiyo's Avatar
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    Jun 2011
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    705
    Character
    Kitori
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Afania View Post
    A lot of problem with the usefulness of inundation is that when you have 3 DD spam WS every 5 sec they generally don't SC with each other.

    If you hold TP and perform 3 steps then you're losing DPS. If you sacrifice 1 support slot for RDM you lose chaos roll etc.
    Don't think you're losing DPS by doing that unless you're zerging mobs aka not having fun playing the game anyways.
    (0)

  3. #43
    Player Urmom's Avatar
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    May 2016
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    449
    Character
    Urmom
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    GEO Lv 99
    It's been a dps loss in most buffed situations with more than 2 dds since Toau times. It's part of why you saw the rise of melee burning things and the decline of skillchain/mb. The dmg lost by holding tp and often using a weaker ws or 2 is very real. Of course there are some exceptions like say having the last ws being significantly stronger than anything the other 2 players are capable of... especially if it scales with tp well so holding hurts less
    (0)

  4. #44
    Player Shiyo's Avatar
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    Jun 2011
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    705
    Character
    Kitori
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    In TOAU SC's got resisted and every TOAU mob not flans has 9999 magic resist/evasion, AND skillchains have been buffed(so that they basically never get resisted) and to do more damage since then.

    So bringing up TOAU doesn't really hold any relevance to the conversation at hand.

    You also don't "hold tp" or "use weaker ws" very often to skillchain anymore with emp/merit ws being so powerful, and damage varies with tp makes sitting on 200 more tp not even matter.

    Skillchaining is always a DPS increase.
    (0)

  5. #45
    Player Urmom's Avatar
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    May 2016
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    449
    Character
    Urmom
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    GEO Lv 99
    I'll give you the resistance thing has changed but mobs weren't super resistant as you claim. Melees just had poor macc. I magic bursted just as well on aht urghan zones as I had done before in cop/zilart. And that was where the bulk of the dmg from sc/mb setups came from. Those setups didn't fall by the wayside because they got worse (except against greaters and that was mostly nuking smart) but because melee burns got better. Partly because lolibri were so squishy but even other targets became easier as we as a community got better at pushing more dmg and understanding things like pdif and haste caps and such. And since the skillchain dmg wasn't ever that significant people just used their most powerful ws

    And yes when talking about 3 dds you will definitely have to hold tp unless you super unbuffed. And doing a 3 step is almost guaranteed going to keep you from using your absolute strongest ws unless you have things setup just right. Having more strong ws doesn't play into that at all. And not all ws have dmg varies with tp and even the ones that their scaling is such that generally at lower tps they aren't spectacular and at higher they don't scale that great so it still matters some

    Also I didn't say skillchaining. I said 3 stepping with 3 dds (well technically I said more than 2 but 4 is even worse) as was being discussed. It in fact makes a huge difference given the time wait between steps and the time it takes to build tp
    (0)
    Last edited by Urmom; 11-29-2016 at 01:53 PM.

  6. #46
    Player Afania's Avatar
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    Aug 2011
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    1,452
    Character
    Afania
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    BRD Lv 1
    Quote Originally Posted by Shiyo View Post
    Don't think you're losing DPS by doing that unless you're zerging mobs aka not having fun playing the game anyways.
    How long have you been enjoying starting drama on forum by claiming everything is "not having fun playing the game"?

    I personally don't see a logical relationship between "zerging" and "not having fun". This applies to other thread regarding certain weapon combinations improving DPS.

    tl;dr: People actually can have fun zerging and do more dmg.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiyo View Post
    Skillchaining is always a DPS increase.
    With 2 DD yes, with 3 DD hardly, with 4 DD I just don't see it. And since this is RDM discussion I'd like to kindly remind people it's also costing a slot of 1 support(or 1 DD) for skillchain increase.
    (1)
    Last edited by Afania; 11-30-2016 at 03:52 PM.

  7. #47
    Player Shiyo's Avatar
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    Jun 2011
    Posts
    705
    Character
    Kitori
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    Zerging = bringing fully buffed melee DD"s and mashing you WS button over and over until the mob dies in 30-60 seconds.
    You ignore the mobs mechanics, you ignore skillchains, you ignore magic bursts. You basically ignore 100% of the games combat mechanics.

    Aka, not fun.

    With 2 DD's skillchaining is always dps increase, I have no idea for 3 but I wonder if you could do samurai skillchaining with 2 other DD's so that every time the other DD's ws the samurai can close it.

    A RDM + melee can just skillchain with each other as well.
    (1)
    Last edited by Shiyo; 12-01-2016 at 11:50 AM.

  8. #48
    Player Catmato's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    972
    Quote Originally Posted by Shiyo View Post
    Aka, not fun.
    Speak for yourself.
    (2)

  9. #49
    Player Shiyo's Avatar
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    Jun 2011
    Posts
    705
    Character
    Kitori
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    If you have fun mashing your WS button and killing bosses in 30-60s ignoring every battle mechanic in the game idk what to say.

    Maybe go back in time and play during embrava + PD zergs? Those things were nerfed because fighting things while invul and mashing your WS key wasn't fun for the majority of the player base and went against the developers vision of the game.
    (0)
    Last edited by Shiyo; 12-03-2016 at 02:10 PM.

  10. #50
    Player Urmom's Avatar
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    May 2016
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    449
    Character
    Urmom
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    GEO Lv 99
    90% of the time zerging isn't about ignoring everything in the game but instead using everything you got to take dps to the max while doing what you can to ensure you survive what the mob is doing to you.
    (1)

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