Page 5 of 7 FirstFirst ... 3 4 5 6 7 LastLast
Results 41 to 50 of 62
  1. #41
    Player Zeargi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Currently: Windurst
    Posts
    743
    Quote Originally Posted by larrymc View Post
    I'm jealous - bst got our % based evasion reduction nerfed away
    How many PUPs do you see vs. BST? Not to mention BST has 100% control over Ready which doesn't require TP to use.
    (4)
    "What is a man? A miserable little pile of secrets. But enough talk... Have at you!" Lord Dracula - [Castlevania:SotN]

  2. #42
    Player Zhronne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Italy
    Posts
    1,050
    Character
    Sechs
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    MNK Lv 99
    Knockout's evasion reduction is not as strong though, and it's way less convenient to use compared to a BST Pet's ~126 cooldown. On PUP you need:
    1) to use a specific automaton (which tipically doesn't provide good damage, so you're taking a big drop in damage just to be able to use Knockout)
    2) to use a specific set of maneuvers and to keep them up to force the automaton to use Knockout instead of other WSs
    3) to make so your pet can hit the target, and then reach enough TP for it to use the WSs
    4) Knockout's eva reduction lasts less than the BST one used to be (unless I'm mistaken? Not 100% sure on this)

    All in all I don't think you can really compare 1:1 the PUP situation and the BST situation when it comes to evasion reduction debuffs.
    (1)
    And the autumn of life has finally come
    with the promise of winter thaw.

  3. #43
    Player dasva's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    1,542
    Character
    Dasva
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    SAM Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by larrymc View Post
    I'm jealous - bst got our % based evasion reduction nerfed away
    It's incorrect though I tested it like a month ago and it definitely wasn't percentage based. It was only -50 for 30 seconds. So similar strength then infrasonics is now but with much shorter duration. The upside is it's an additional effect on dmg you are already doing instead of having to waste a move putting a debuff on a mob that you can't tell when it wears off because it's too hard to put that in chat log so if you are using that frame you can actually spam it to keep it on without hindering your dmg much more than you were by just using that frame (and mage frames I've noticed are sometimes being used for their tanking anyways)

    Either way though you are better off just getting a rdm to debuff it or even /rdm half the time

    Anyways as far as the dmg posts goes it's put in a way that's a bit different then how we generally have formulas.

    Any theories on what it means? My thought is those +% dmg are basically just compared to a normal melee hit.. basically kind of what we would think of ftp. So a ws with say base +500% dmg and another +500% at 3k tp would be one with base 6.0 ftp and 11.0 at 3k. I started to do some really rough dmg comparisons between regular hits and ws and it seems to somewhat line up though stat mods add in too. And for the multi hit ones will they transfer like most ws do these days or just 1.0 for the additional? If transfer bonecrusher could be pretty amazing with flameholder

    Another thing I've noted though was while a lot of those melee ws look good... and really their stats are pretty good to the point of being about as good as the ranged ones. The problem is the melee hits of all frames are only dealing like 250-300 dmg on lvl 0 mobs so no matter how great the ws stats are your dmg is going to be weak. It's like a melee DD using a weapon with the base dmg of something from lvl 75 (this is of course a bit of an exaggeration but not as big as you might think given the base delay). Oh the other end the rng frames shots do like 1-1.2k which is not bad so it's ws do ok despite similar ws stats.

    tl;dr raise auto melee base dmg because it seems like they haven't really raised it with ilvl at all
    (0)
    Last edited by dasva; 09-05-2015 at 08:59 AM.

  4. #44
    Player AtrixWolfe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    76
    Character
    Verda
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by dasva View Post
    It's incorrect though I tested it like a month ago and it definitely wasn't percentage based. It was only -50 for 30 seconds. So similar strength then infrasonics is now but with much shorter duration.

    Someone recently tested feint as well, and the information it was % based was also wrong. It is enough to make me wonder if any % based info is right at all.
    (0)

  5. #45
    Player dasva's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    1,542
    Character
    Dasva
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    SAM Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by AtrixWolfe View Post
    Someone recently tested feint as well, and the information it was % based was also wrong. It is enough to make me wonder if any % based info is right at all.
    Well feint decayed so it was really easy to mess up with parses and/or checking mobs. The jug -evasion moves definitely were right though.
    (0)

  6. #46
    Player Stamos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Posts
    61
    Character
    Stamos
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    BLU Lv 99
    Curious if there is any chance Automaton WS damage will be boosted? Still stands that Automaton WS damage is the weakest of the pet jobs(BST,SMN, and PUP) and Automatons have to accumulate TP. I know there is no plans to add a way to set which weaponskill the Automaton does. But, since that is the case you either have to hurt your damage to make sure the Automaton does the proper weaponskill or hurt the Automaton's damage.
    (1)

  7. #47
    Player xiozen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    San'doria
    Posts
    297
    Character
    Xiozan
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    PUP Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Stamos View Post
    Curious if there is any chance Automaton WS damage will be boosted?
    What kind of numbers in damage do you believe the automaton should be performing at? And are those numbers with or without all, some or a few, 3 star "gifts"? I'm a full time PUP as well and I don't have any issue with my automaton's damage output...

    Quote Originally Posted by Stamos View Post
    Still stands that Automaton WS damage is the weakest of the pet jobs(BST,SMN, and PUP) and Automatons have to accumulate TP.
    Well I think all the pet jobs accumulation of TP, has some form of an impact on the overall damage the pet does; BST I believe has charges tied to TP and SMN's avatar's TP is tied to overall damage of the bloodpact rage performed...

    Quote Originally Posted by Stamos View Post
    I know there is no plans to add a way to set which weaponskill the Automaton does. But, since that is the case you either have to hurt your damage to make sure the Automaton does the proper weaponskill or hurt the Automaton's damage.
    Not quite sure what is meant here, since you acknowledged that the master can "make sure the Automaton does the proper weaponskill"... which means there is a way for the master to "force" the weaponskill of choice... how does this translate into hurting dmg? I think it helps. Example, when I farmed in Reisenjima against a highly evasive NM; I "forced" my harlequin to use "Knockout", which helped my party gather TP for continous weaponskills and bursts. There are significant benefits to being able to "force" the weaponskill... so perhaps you can explain what you are seeking.
    (0)

    {DISCLAIMER} Posts may contain opinions based on personal experiences that are not meant to be taken as facts. What may appear as fact with no source reference may be recollection of information with no source, and may be subject to scrutiny without source reference. Any debate may be considered conjecture of all parties in that debate. Player comments may not be the expressed position/consent of SE, their affiliates, or any employees of said organizations.

  8. #48
    Player Stamos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Posts
    61
    Character
    Stamos
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    BLU Lv 99
    My PUP has been Master for quite a while. So, was talking from that standpoint. Without Overdrive, Automaton WSD is extremely lacking. Think last thing I did was VD Antlion Ambuscade, my Automaton WS dmg ranged from 1.5 to 5k. And that was with GEO giving frailty and torpor.

    Charges are on a timer, which are reduced with gifts and gear. You are able to gain one charge per ten seconds with appropriate gear. You start with three. Alongside the fact you get Pet TP Bonus gear, even having no TP on bst you are actually using ready with over 1000 at minimum. So, you are doing 10-20k every 10 seconds on BST, if the ready move is one charge. While, summoner can do 10-99k every twenty seconds. Automaton output is not anywhere close to either of these.

    And, to the last point. PUP's highest damage weaponskill is either Smite or Raging Fists. Using the Valoredge frame, smite will cause it to use Stringing Shredder which is mostly awful. Requiring you to use Spiral first to force Bonecrusher for light, then Smite for double light/radiance.
    (0)

  9. #49
    Player Urmom's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    448
    Character
    Urmom
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    GEO Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by xiozen View Post
    What kind of numbers in damage do you believe the automaton should be performing at? And are those numbers with or without all, some or a few, 3 star "gifts"? I'm a full time PUP as well and I don't have any issue with my automaton's damage output...


    Well I think all the pet jobs accumulation of TP, has some form of an impact on the overall damage the pet does; BST I believe has charges tied to TP and SMN's avatar's TP is tied to overall damage of the bloodpact rage performed...

    Not quite sure what is meant here, since you acknowledged that the master can "make sure the Automaton does the proper weaponskill"... which means there is a way for the master to "force" the weaponskill of choice... how does this translate into hurting dmg? I think it helps. Example, when I farmed in Reisenjima against a highly evasive NM; I "forced" my harlequin to use "Knockout", which helped my party gather TP for continous weaponskills and bursts. There are significant benefits to being able to "force" the weaponskill... so perhaps you can explain what you are seeking.
    For dmg my master autos get up to 13-14k bone crushers with capped pdif during overdrive against dmg neutral targets. Which is great compared to what we were at before. But then you consider the strongest bst moves cap out at around 30k, bps can go to the dmg cap, and that like blus can fairly consistently do 30ks with capped att and people with strong magical ws can go much higher it's not as hot in comparison and those are without having to use SPs


    It's more of a can. Like some jug moves tp has no effect on dmg and even the ones it does it does very little after all the tp bonus gear and smn again not all bps use tp. iirc it's only the merit ones

    As far as the forcing thing he is most likely referring to how you have to do things that hurt your dmg in order to force those ws. Like using sub optimal maneuvers or using sub optimum starter ws to get it to skillchain with what you want. For example let's say you wanted bone crusher because it for the most part does more damage than string shredder... to force it with maneuvers you can either not use any thunder and lose out on a bunch of acc, da and such or if you do use thunder you have to use double light and lose out on a bunch of att and attuners ignore def massively lowering your dmg
    (0)
    Last edited by Urmom; 06-28-2016 at 04:24 AM.

  10. #50
    Player nyheen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    197
    Character
    Nyheen
    World
    Bismarck
    Main Class
    PUP Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Chcayne View Post
    ご意見ありがとうございます。



    先日公開した7月バージョンアップのお知らせですが、
    記事制作時点の予定をまとめてお伝えしています。
    そのため、大枠の情報のみでまとめていることが多く、
    記事制作後に追加となった案件などが含まれないことがあります。

    射撃戦フレーム「ヘーゼルサジタリウス」の射撃威力調整は、
    7月のバージョンアップにて実装いたします。
    詳しい情報は、バージョンアップ当日のお知らせをお待ちください。
    in eng (google tran)
    Thank you for your opinion.

    rinoshiri's Avatar
    QuotePosted By Originally Rinoshiri View Post
    Only pet command to the announcement of July in the
    riding adjustment of shooting mutton Neeeeeeeeeeeee
    Was published the other day announcement of the July version up you, but,
    I have to tell together the plans of the article production time.
    Therefore, often are summarized only in the information of the outline,
    it may not include such projects became added after article production. Shooting power adjustment of the shooting game frame "Hazel Sagittarius" is, it will be implemented in the July version up. For more information, please wait for the version up the day of announcement.

    what does they mean by this? does this mean our rng pet getting a boost this update?
    (0)

Page 5 of 7 FirstFirst ... 3 4 5 6 7 LastLast