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Thread: PLD/NIN

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  1. #1
    Player Avidon's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Location
    San d'Oria
    Posts
    66
    Character
    Avidon
    World
    Carbuncle
    Main Class
    PLD Lv 99

    PLD/NIN

    Any good tips on how to effectively use this combination? Thanks.
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  2. #2
    Player Lyndonn's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Location
    Sandy
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    12
    Character
    Lyndonn
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    PLD Lv 90
    alot of haste for Flash timer, and Emnity gear for other slots u cant get haste in also alot of Emnity for Sentinel build and rampart
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  3. #3
    Player Ryx's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    56
    Character
    Rayix
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    DRG Lv 99

    If you understand paladin, it'll all come naturally.

    It's the same fundamentals as tanking /warrior - macro Enmity for JAs, TP/WS in DD gear, haste for flash, PDT/MDT oshit builds, etc, etc.

    Macro in a little more fast cast / shield skill into Ichi and Haste into Ni. Ex: Creed Armet +2 for Ichi, full Haste helm for Ni. Since /nin Ichi & Ni are 3 shadows/each, I tend to idle Ichi shadows whenever I cast between fights.

    If you aren't familar with the basics of Utsusemi: Ichi overwrites Ichi, Ni overwrites Ni and Ichi, Ichi does NOT overwrite Ni. If you start casting Ichi before you lose your last shadow tho, because of its long cast time, you'll get shadows back up just after the mob attacks and takes the previous one. Use Reprisal or Rampart (if you have Iron will merits) if you find yourself having trouble to get shadows up in a tight spot.

    As the old saying goes: Paladin doesn't evade, the monster whiffs. You can rely more on NOT evading to time shadow casting than you can evading. It takes some time & practice to get a good feel for how to use shadows, but it's the standard of how endgame paladin has tanked for years.

    One of the big things to remember is this: You can blood tank on Pld/Nin if the situation calls for it, you won't lose out on much except Fencer/double attack by not having /war. You cannot shadow tank /war, so you can't throw up shadows to absorb a huge nuke, or avoid getting hit by additional effects / colossal DPH. This is why I default to /nin on Pld.

    Really tho, I don't find playstyle between pld/nin and pld/war to be much different, but that may just be me, since I've always played the part of a hatemonger, not a turtle.
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  4. #4
    Player Gradd's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    66
    Character
    Gradd
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    DRK Lv 90
    Don't you get a 20% Absorb rate with 4/5 AF3+2 Body/Hands/Feet/Legs, making PLD/WAR alot more Capable than it used to be? x:

    I say 4/5 because 5/5 (25% Absorb rate) you give up your head slot, which is a huge Haste slot and not worth giving up.

    Edit:

    Anyone know if the Absorb works on a mobs TP moves?
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  5. #5
    Player Arcon's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Location
    San d'Oria
    Posts
    2,753
    Character
    Arcon
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    PLD Lv 99
    Utsusemi is key to mastering PLD/NIN. Here's my tips for using Utsusemi as a subjob.

    Timing
    Utsusemi: Ni can normally be timed in between enemy attacks, only certain mobs make that less of an option (Chigoes, MNK using Hundred Fists). Note that some mobs appear to attack fast, but don't, name mobs that Double/Triple Attack. Every PLD/NIN who has tanked Byakko before will testify to that, once an enemy starts an attack round, you can start casting Utsusemi: Ni. It will look as if the enemy's other hits land while you're casting, but it won't interrupt your spell.

    Utsusemi: Ichi is a lot harder to time, not only because of its longer casting time, but also because it doesn't overwrite shadows obtained from Utsusemi: Ni. It can be timed to fit in between standard delay attacks, however that is very hard to do, and you shouldn't rely on that for efficient tanking. Instead, there's several ways to be efficient about this, one of them is to rely on the remaining shadows.

    Alternating Ichi and Ni will usually be enough to cycle, provided some mage support with Haste, and some Haste/Fast Cast gear. So what you can do is notice the remaining shadows. If it says 1 shadow is remaining, then cast the next Utsusemi: Ichi. The next enemy hit will wipe that shadow, and you will get 3 new shadows right away. However, if the enemy misses or is paralyzed, that 1 shadow will remain, and your Utsusemi: Ichi will have no effect. There's als techniques to prevent this. If you have 1 shadow remaining, don't immediately cast, but wait before the enemy is about to attack. Then start casting, and if you don't lose that shadow, there's still enough time to manually cancel it. For that you should also have the cursor over the Copy Image icon, so you can get to it fast.

    Another way to avoid this, is to block attacks with your shield. Both equipping shield skill and having Reprisal up will help a lot with that.

    Also, since PLD got Phalanx, there's another option: using Sentinel (especially with AF2 boots) will damage mitigation very high, with Phalanx up you will take 0 damage for a while. And taking 0 damage won't interrupt your spells either, so that can be used to get shadows up as well, especially in tight situations.

    Gear
    Depending on your macro proficiency, you will have up to 4 different gearsets, some of which may be combined.
    1. Before starting to cast the spell: Fast Cast
    2. While the spell is casting: Shield skill > Spell Interrupt rate down > DEF
    3. Right before the spell activates: Haste > Fast Cast (Homam Cosciales will beat Creed Cuisses +2, and remember Loquacious Earring, Nuevo Coselete) > Enmity
    4. After the spell lands: Back to idle gear

    The first and second are often combined, and often only for Utsusemi: Ichi, since Ni can be timed in between attacks anyway. Sometimes people even use only Haste/Fast Cast and Shield skill/Enmity only in spots that are left over, as I said, it depends on your macro proficiency. In general you wanna cap recast on either Utsusemi, followed by enmity (it does generate a bit, not major, but there's plenty of slots left over, so may as well make the best of it).

    General Tips
    - Get Utsusemi: Ichi up before the fight and wait for recast to cool down. Then start the Utsusemi cycle with Ichi.
    - Try to go Ichi > Ichi whenever possible, keep Ni for emergencies. However, often you won't have this luxury.
    - AoE spells will strip your shadows, use this to your advantage. Start casting Ichi so it will land shortly after the AoE spell, so it's up right again.
    - Some TP moves will consume more than 1 shadow, so keep that in mind.
    - Make sure you always have room to use toolbags in your inventory, and for that matter, make sure you always have extra toolbags (and for that matter, make sure you have Shihei in the first place).
    - Once shadows are up, there's no reason to mount heavy DEF. Use Haste/Accuracy gear while shadows are up.

    Keep in mind that it will take some experience to get used to it. You have to know enemy TP delay, Utsusemi: Ichi casting time, macro positions, several important AoE spell casting time and all those things by heart. This will take some while, so you shouldn't try to tank the hardest mobs right away.

    Apart from Utsusemi, it's pretty much the same as general PLD tanking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gradd View Post
    Don't you get a 20% Absorb rate with 4/5 AF3+2 Body/Hands/Feet/Legs, making PLD/WAR alot more Capable than it used to be? x:
    I don't have it, so can't say, but that sounds extremely high. Most other AF3+2 bonus (for the full set) is in the range of 5~10% activation rate, so I find it hard to imagine being that high. Wiki says it's at 5% for the full set, 4% for 4/5.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gradd View Post
    Anyone know if the Absorb works on a mobs TP moves?
    Yes.
    (0)

  6. #6
    Player Gradd's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    66
    Character
    Gradd
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    DRK Lv 90
    Ok yea, my Bad. Apparently some asshat changed it to 25% for 5/5 on wiki but it was removed a while ago (changed to confirmation needed) looked it up on BG seems to be more around 6-10%.
    (0)
    Last edited by Gradd; 04-08-2011 at 08:49 PM.