Hachirin-no-Obi

[Protey]

So because this is rare for you, you're against them changing it, because screw everyone else?

Just you making up more garbage. I think you should see a therapist for your delusions. where did I say screw everyone else? o that's right, I didn't. I just said I'm glad it existed because it saved me inventory space.

You're advocating this restriction without getting something worthwhile in return, simply FC-2 comparatively, versus the current situations "losing a small amount of elemental damage" in this rare (for you) situation that occurs.

where did I advocate the restriction? o that's right, I didn't. More of your delusions. And 7 inventory space is something worthwhile.

Who casts cure in Dyna and Nyzul? Thousands of people over the course of the 10 years you cited, and even today, I sometimes go in Blu to cleave when I have a friend who needs a particular piece from a zone, and I have them come as something that can cure me, this is only really for obtaining whatever gear they're after, not for general farming. You'd be surprised at how much damage you can take even at i119 with a crapton of beastmen 2hring you. And in Nyzul when farming tokens, the Brd or Smn who is primarily there to increase our movement speed will occasionally toss cures, and again, over the 10 year history you cited, tons of people.

I expected you to know that I meant now. Guess that was too much of a logical leap for you. When I do nyzul for tokens, cures are never needed, ever. When I do dyna I am thf/dnc... so yea, no curing.

[Selindrile]

[SARCASM]Yeah, I'm the delusional one making up things.[/SARCASM]

Just you making up more garbage. I think you should see a therapist for your delusions. where did I say screw everyone else? o that's right, I didn't. I just said I'm glad it existed because it saved me inventory space.

i like it the way it is.

where did I advocate the restriction? o that's right, I didn't. More of your delusions. And 7 inventory space is something worthwhile.

i like it the way it is.

I expected you to know that I meant now. Guess that was too much of a logical leap for you. When I do nyzul for tokens, cures are never needed, ever. When I do dyna I am thf/dnc... so yea, no curing.

in the 10 years I have been playing this game.

[Singforu]

[SARCASM]Yeah, I'm the delusional one making up things.[/SARCASM]

yes, yes you are. "I like it the way it is" refers to saving inventory space and right after that comment it was said for situations in which it can't be used to use the other obi. It does not advocate any sort of restriction. You seem to have some problem with this simple concept so I am going to spell it out for you: not minding something is not the same as advocating something.

your last part where you quoted the 10 years... that was to nuking (way to go on transferring the quote to something different), that doesn't mean it was referring to nyzul for the last 10 years... it hasn't even been out that long obviously. and of course when it was introduced people had to cure, it was at 75 cap. so yea, anyone with half a brain would have figured out that it was referring to now.

[Selindrile]

No, you were saying you liked how the obi was now (if you weren't, you'd be agreeing with me), providing the negative as well as the positive buffs, and thus being useless when both effects came into play. Also, you said "this situation came up 3 times in the past 10 years", I provided current examples, as well as pointing out that it would've happened rather frequently over said past 10 years that you cited these situations might have cropped up.

And for the record, I didn't report your main account despite your vitriol, if you thought I did, I would rather nobody get banned for discussing things, even if they're being insulting.

[SMD111]

I'm going to say this because some people dont get it.

1. if you cast a spell on the oposing day with no corresponding weather without the obi your spell is weaker no mater what you do
example: casting "Fire" on "Watersday" with no weather lowers the power of "Fire"

2. if you cast a spell on the oposing day with the corresponding weather(lvl1) without the obi your spell is not weaker
example: casting "Fire" on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" does not lower or increase the power of "Fire" it just nutralizes the day effects

3. if you cast a spell on the oposing day with the corresponding weather(lvl2) without the obi your spell is stronger
example: casting "Fire" on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" increases the power of "Fire"

4. if you cast a spell on the oposing day with the elemantal weather(lvl1) with the obi your spell is not weaker or stronger
example: casting "Fire" on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" does not lower or increase the power of "Fire" it just nutralizes the day effects

5. if you cast a spell on the oposing day with the elemantal weather(lvl2) with the obi your spell is stronger
example: casting "Fire" on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" increases the power of "Fire"

so when you do not use an elemental obi
on "Watersday" with no weather your "Fire" spell will get weaker
on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" your "Fire" spell will not get weaker
on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" your "Fire" spell will get stronger

so when you use the Karin Obi
on "Watersday" with no weather your "Fire" spell will get weaker
on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" your "Fire" spell will not get weaker
on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" your "Fire" spell will get stronger

so when you use the Hachirin-no-Obi
on "Watersday" with no weather your "Fire" spell will get weaker but you also get MP not depleted when magic used +1%
on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" your "Fire" spell will not get weaker but you also get MP not depleted when magic used +1%
on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" your "Fire" spell will get stronger but you also get MP not depleted when magic used +1%

this is all irrefutable

also if you do not like the new obi go get your obi again

[Ulth]

I'm going to say this because some people dont get it.

1. if you cast a spell on the oposing day with no corresponding weather without the obi your spell is weaker no mater what you do
example: casting "Fire" on "Watersday" with no weather lowers the power of "Fire"

2. if you cast a spell on the oposing day with the corresponding weather(lvl1) without the obi your spell is not weaker
example: casting "Fire" on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" does not lower or increase the power of "Fire" it just nutralizes the day effects

3. if you cast a spell on the oposing day with the corresponding weather(lvl2) without the obi your spell is stronger
example: casting "Fire" on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" increases the power of "Fire"

4. if you cast a spell on the oposing day with the elemantal weather(lvl1) with the obi your spell is not weaker or stronger
example: casting "Fire" on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" does not lower or increase the power of "Fire" it just nutralizes the day effects

5. if you cast a spell on the oposing day with the elemantal weather(lvl2) with the obi your spell is stronger
example: casting "Fire" on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" increases the power of "Fire"

so when you do not use an elemental obi
on "Watersday" with no weather your "Fire" spell will get weaker
on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" your "Fire" spell will not get weaker
on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" your "Fire" spell will get stronger

so when you use the Karin Obi
on "Watersday" with no weather your "Fire" spell will get weaker
on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" your "Fire" spell will not get weaker
on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" your "Fire" spell will get stronger

so when you use the Hachirin-no-Obi
on "Watersday" with no weather your "Fire" spell will get weaker but you also get MP not depleted when magic used +1%
on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" your "Fire" spell will not get weaker but you also get MP not depleted when magic used +1%
on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" your "Fire" spell will get stronger but you also get MP not depleted when magic used +1%

this is all irrefutable

also if you do not like the new obi go get your obi again

Irrefutable. I don't think it means, what you think it means.

so when you do not use an elemental obi
on "Watersday" with no weather your "Fire" spell will have a 1/5 chance of doing 10% less damage
on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" your "Fire" spell will have a 1/5 chance of doing 10% less damage, and a 1/3 chance of doing 10% more damage
on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" your "Fire" spell will have a 1/5 chance of doing 10% less damage, and a 1/3 chance of doing 25% more damage

so when you use the Karin Obi
on "Watersday" with no weather your "Fire" spell will have a 1/5 chance of doing 10% less damage
on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" your "Fire" spell will have a 1/5 chance of doing 10% less damage, and always does 10% more damage
on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" your "Fire" spell will have a 1/5 chance of doing 10% less damage, and always does 25% more damage

so when you use the Hachirin-no-Obi
on "Watersday" with no weather your "Fire" spell will always do 10% less damage but you also get MP not depleted when magic used +1%
on "Watersday" with "Hot Spells" your "Fire" spell will not get weaker but you also get MP not depleted when magic used +1%, <<This one was actually right and is what people are upset about.
on "Watersday" with "Heat Waves" your "Fire" spell will always do 10% less damage, and 25% more damage, but you also get MP not depleted when magic used +1%

The outcry for this issue is how the ws gorgets and belts have no draw backs of being combined, saving them a few inventory slots where as there are draw backs to using Hachirin-no-Obi. I don't think it needs to have 100% not procing bad weather/day, but it at least shouldn't have 100% proc of bad weather/day.

[SMD111]

Irrefutable. I don't think it means, what you think it means.

impossible to deny or disprove.

i did these tests my self and all the differences in the spells power with the obi's are less then 3%(mathematically insignificant) from what i posted

and i did my tests on an nm that was neither strong nor weak to the element i was using so what i say is accurate

i cam to my conclusion by using a spell 100 times under the conditions and the averaging the attack done then seeing the difference between the 3 sets

no obi == low power
obi == the same power +/- 2.89%

[Ulth]

impossible to deny or disprove.

i did these tests my self and all the differences in the spells power with the obi's are less then 3%(mathematically insignificant) from what i posted

and i did my tests on an nm that was neither strong nor weak to the element i was using so what i say is accurate

i cam to my conclusion by using a spell 100 times under the conditions and the averaging the attack done then seeing the difference between the 3 sets

no obi == low power
obi == the same power +/- 2.89%

Well for one a 3% increase in damage is not insignificant, but you actually should be seeing a +8% in damage increase between Karin Obi and Hachirin-no-Obi.

[dasva]

Should also add that

1) there is no need to test anything as all these numbers and formula are known and day/weather proc rates are well known. With opposing day and single weather positive weather wearing the obi of just the weather or the day and no other weather/day related gear will provide an average increase dmg of 6.7% over Hachirin-no-Obi. With opposing day and double weather positive weather wearing the obi of just the weather and no other weather/day related gear will provide an average increase dmg of 5.8% over Hachirin-no-Obi

2) 100 casts isn't exactly a huge sample size when trying to get an exact percentage difference especially when it's that low.

3) This game has been about cranking out that extra .01% difference for years now so 3% is huge.