Gross exaggeration. No one said or demanded that.
Another gross exaggeration. No one asked for it to be given to them. And let's be honest here. Killing weak mobs is easy. The only achievement you are unlocking is longer log in time.
If you're not sure what job points do, go look it up. I think we all know that they aren't going to continue adding more powerful items and stats to the job point system without increasing the difficulty of content. That would be incredibly dumb. You can stop pretending that they aren't. We also know that being a requirement from a technical standpoint has nothing to do with being able to beat the content. It's about actually getting into groups to do the content in the first place. Just because you can beat <XXX> on a butt naked white mage doesn't mean anyone is going to let you come.
If you look back, you'll notice that they decreased the requirements for all those events because people were discouraged by them. Games that aren't fun don't make money. Insane difficulty and / or time sinks only hold the interest of a very small demographic. For many people, everything about FFXI fits that definition.
In all honesty, they should be rewarding stuff like that with aesthetic items that are functionally the same, but with unique appearances and / or titles instead. It doesn't make sense to reward people who like a challenge with things that make everything less challenging.
Oddly enough, that's exactly how I got them. I learned how to manage servers, websites, networks etc. while playing video games late at night. Goofing off.
There are base requirements in life that society deems necessary just like there are in the game. You don't need a car or a house or nice clothes to survive. You can go all "naked and afraid" and sleep in a hut made of pine needles. But nobody is going to want to hang out with you. That's where job points are headed. No one wants to play with the guy who is way behind in performance. Even if he is good enough to beat the content. Because, people don't want a group that can beat the content. They want a group that will beat the content and fast.
Yes, because that's the only choice. There is absolutely no way that they could ever just lessen the requirements. That would be impossible. They have to either keep them exactly the same or remove the requirements entirely. there is no other choice. There can be no middle ground. If they even gave one more CAP per kill, the whole game would implode. /SMH
Why can't you?
I agree, but I'd rather see them become what they said they were going to be. A bonus that would accrue just by regularly playing the job. Not something that you had to specifically go do for hours and hours. You keep complaining about people wanting something for nothing, but in this case that's exactly what it was supposed to be. These weren't advertised as a challenge like a relic or something. They were advertised as something that would just happen as natural progression from playing the jobs.
Maybe, but I think there's a happy middle ground somewhere and this ain't it.
It literally took me 10 minutes to get my tinhaspa.
Please see the countless threads / posts / discussions / websites complaining about certain gear / stats being "Required" by group leaders even though they aren't actually necessary to win the fight. It's about efficiency. Not just winning.
Because having job points makes new content easier. Being able to do content more easily makes you more desirable to groups and other players. Being desirable gets you invited to events, parties, link shells etc. . All of these things make the game more enjoyable. Sometimes you have to do things you don't like to get things that you do like. The problem is when the part that you don't like outweighs the part you do. You can't make all the people happy all the time, but they can certainly do better than this.
And please can we stop ignoring that JP are way harder to get on some jobs than others... and ironically those are the jobs that the devs are "fixing" with job points rather than just fixing the jobs...
Honestly there are so many straw men in here it's a wonder anyone can breathe. No one is suggesting we all just should log in and be handed max job points -
What people are saying is this system was sold as a tiny little bonus you got for playing your fave jobs. Except, instead they are adding what should be core class abilities or class fixes to this horrendous grind. FFXI is already the most grindy game ever - we really didn't need this as a new required grind.
And yeah yeah before people say "they won't be required" that's nonsense and we all know it. Christ we could all beat voidwatch without the minor bonuses for atmacites but group leaders still shouted for people that had maxed out certain ones.
Honestly if it was just an extra 5 accuracy or something I wouldn't worry about it, but the difference between a BST pet with 2% extra haste or one with 30% haste is pretty huge. These aren't minor differences, especially for a job that needs all the help it can get.
I don't work somewhere where I can grind job points all day and I have other hobbies I want to engage in after work. I came back to FFXI because I could have fun playing it casually. If it's going to turn into PLEASE GRIND 500 HOURS KILLING MOBS MINDLESSLY BEFORE YOU CAN JOIN CONTENT... ughhh no thanks.
Anyway we should all be concerned about it because whenever devs put a system this grindy in place it is not because they are planning to add a lot of new content. But hey if you think it's worth paying a 15+ sub per month to kill the same mob over and over again with no variation or even actual content...
Last edited by Olor; 01-30-2015 at 03:14 AM.
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Personally, when I shouted to make a Woh Gates CP party (which I did a lot during the event, and more to fill missing spots), I just shout (job) (anything) and just go with whatever we get. The party fills up very fast and we're out there within 5-10 minutes. Any time we ever do poorly (which is rare) it's because the players are undergeared or underskilled. I've had DRKs, multiple PUPs, no WHM, no BRD, whatever. I've also had RUNs and even a PLD (though the PLD was sub nin and dual wielding Burtgang and Excalibur). I never had a BST ask to join. The most common job, was, of course, THF, but there was also a lot of BLU.And please can we stop ignoring that JP are way harder to get on some jobs than others
We just go with what we get, and usually get at least get 300k CP/hr during the event. The only time it was lower is when people keep AFKing or, like I said, the players are not good, not because of the jobs. It was also a good source of sparks and accolades, and a lot of Sacred Kindred Seals. I made pretty good gil just off the sparks.
Granted, as a SMN, I am fulfilling the roles we're missing, but a lot of players can do that. If we're missing heals, I just play healer. We always have buffs (Hastega II/etc), so we're in decent shape there. Dancers can heal too (or anyone can sub dancer), we had PUPs bringing white mage automatons, lots of jobs can provide other useful buffs, etc. We had people subbing Corsair just to do Corsair's Roll, the same can be done with mage jobs for haste, hunter's roll for accuracy if you need it (sushi is fine), whatever.
If you want to get CP, just make a party. The public shout parties might deny you, but that's just because the person making the party wants a specific setup. You can still make sure you get at least one person who can heal or buff, and there's multiple viable camps. I just finished pretty much all my job point categories on Summoner within 3 days during the event, missing only one category that I don't really care about (and already have enough stored to max the two new ones).
And yeah, getting CP can kinda take a while, but it just depends on how much you want and how much time you want to spend. Like I said, I was getting 300k/hr (375k+ with corsair) with random party setups, which is around 10 job points per hour. That's about 6 hours to max one category. They definitely need to add more ways to get CP (new alluvion skirmish maybe) but Incursion and delve are pretty good too (my GEO has all gifts just off of doing delve). The system is a little grindy and takes a while, but you can finish it all up for a job (or the categories you care about) pretty quickly if you just push it during a CP event.
Last edited by Crevox; 01-30-2015 at 03:48 AM.
Today I saw somebody leveling in Woh gates or Sih gates or some adoulin shit. The character names were Hyuran and Miqoten. It was at that point I realized that this game will be here forever.
Then you won't be able to do the content. Make yourself better to the point where you are accepted. Or, /gasp, make your own party.
Precisely why people are trying to prevent people like you from making it less grindy. If you want a less grindy game, go play something else, there are many out there. Stop trying to make FFXI less like FFXI.
Oh, you are psychic now. You've already foreseen all this new content that requires a certain level of JPs and that people won't get invited. Oh and mysteriously you are somehow unable to make your own parties.
They should go the other way, give less CP per kill. And do away with all these double CP campaigns.
And one can still get them just by natural progression from playing the jobs. You don't have to go get them. Your argument is void.
So go make your own party. Or are you incapable of making things happen for yourself?
This happened a lot in my parties:
Player: hi can I come drg?
Crevox: sure, of course
Player: wow ok tyPlayer: hi i have brd, whm, thf
Crevox: bring whichever you want
Player: can i come drk?
Crevox: sure, if that's what you want to bring, that's fine
Player: ok ty
What you people fail to realize is that the game is a journey, not an end point. When you make things easier to get, you make it so people don't want to play. Why? because there is nothing to do. That is why you have people only logging on for new content, which is rare. By having long term goals with grindy requirements, there is something to do. If some of you have it your way we'll be capped out on JPs/Gifts in no time and then what, SE will have to come out with new content. Now I'm pretty sure everyone does want new content, but without grindy requirements the new content will be beaten in short order and people will have nothing to do again. So SE has to come out with even more new content. However, that is not something that can be done in a short amount of time. Also, by coming out with new content over and over again in a relatively short time we have things like what happened with Skirmish gear. I know I was a bit peaved with spending 90 million gil on using stones then having to do it all over again with the +1 gear a short time later. So stop advocating for making things less grindy.
I can vouch for the problem of making things too easy and how that results in people quitting the game. The LS I am on has always been your typical "new player LS" and we have always picked up any new player we find, and helped them with the stuff they need, things that other more snobby LS refer to in the derogatory term "no needy noobs." Our LS has been around forever and has always been happy to take them and their needyness lol.
One thing I noticed in the years 2010~2014, and more noticeably after SoA arrived, was that we had a steady flow of new players joining all the time, and they leeched aby sandsweepers from lvl 30~99 plus capped merits, all in short time, and all while wearing their New-Adventurer pyjamas, often not using a single /ja, /ma or /ws for those whole 69 levels plus hundreds of merits.
What happened was that they ended up standing in Adoulin on lvl 99 (capped merits) barely a fortnight after joining the game, and within a month they were saying stuff like "omg not more delve / WKR / skirmish" and "I'm so bored" and "I quit." The LS saw many of these new players join the game and reach endgame stage within a few weeks, and then quit the game in boredom a few weeks later.
And the difference between new players arriving on the LS in 2004~2009, they took ages to get lvl 75 and they dreamed of one day having capped merits. And they didn't quit. Those players stayed on for years, not weeks. And made lots of friends on the journey too.
And because the levelling process had given these new players the "journey" mindset which you mentioned, this made them more enthusiastic about other journeys in FFXI such as crafting/missions/quests/RME etc. This is very different to the new players our LS saw leeching Aby in their pyjamas and then saying how bored they were and quitting after a fortnight. So I think you are right, when the journey is taken away, people end up standing around at the destination and just kicking dust.
Also if the double CAP events are going to be really really frequent, like more frequent than normal capacity times, they should just call those double-events "normal CAP" events and other times "half CAP" events lol. Next week, a special rare event, half capacity points!
Last edited by Stompa; 01-30-2015 at 09:57 AM.
Why do you think people are asking for lower requirements on the JP system? They want to be better...
I'll do what I want. I've been playing this game since the JP release and I'll keep trying to make it better for me and other people like me until they shut it down whether you like it or not. Deal with it.
No, I just possess adequate mental faculties to recognize a trend that hasn't changed in over ten years of FFXI.
Yes. People who don't have experience because they don't get invites have a much harder time actually leading groups. Leading a bunch of failed runs adn / or constantly asking someone else to lead your party quickly leads to people not joining your groups.
You don't have to get them either. You can waste time killing bunnies all day without the JP system. Your argument is void.
I'm very capable. I'm just not a dick to people who aren't.
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