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  1. #21
    Player Martel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    249
    Character
    Martel
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    DRG Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Balloon View Post
    You're right, I was using old values for Cure 5. The new adjusted ones ones are 300/600

    With Tranquil Heart it'd be something like (300CE/600VE) *0.5(-50 Gear Cap)*0.75(Tranquil Heart) .. or 112CE/225VE. Point is you can't really generate enough hate with cures to even compete with damage generated enmity.

    Hell, I didn't even factor the effects of Divine Benison there, and I should.

    If the CE Modifier seems to increase how it always has then it should be at 40/79 for cures using the hp cured formula. It doesn't work like this. It was changed to 40/170.

    Edit: Fixes.
    Divine benison only works on status removal spells. So no, don't factor for it.
    (0)

  2. #22
    Player
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    317
    Quote Originally Posted by Martel View Post
    Divine benison only works on status removal spells. So no, don't factor for it.
    Good job I'm lazy, I guess.

    Though maybe I'd have read the description more closely if I weren't.
    (0)

  3. #23
    Player Aramaic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    29
    Character
    Aramaic
    World
    Lakshmi
    Main Class
    DRG Lv 99
    Camate wouldn't the simplest solution be for Pld to have a higher enmity cap than every other job. I mean if the Dev's truly want Pld to be the job for tanking purposes. Increasing the gear cap doesn't do shit when the cap will still be the same for melee who reach it insanely fast still by just pumping out damage. I currently wear every piece of Enmity + you can get for every action I use to maintain monster focus but when melee reach the same cap that I am at its a crap shoot at that point.
    (1)

  4. #24
    Player Damane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    715
    Character
    Damane
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    DNC Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Aramaic View Post
    Camate wouldn't the simplest solution be for Pld to have a higher enmity cap than every other job. I mean if the Dev's truly want Pld to be the job for tanking purposes. Increasing the gear cap doesn't do shit when the cap will still be the same for melee who reach it insanely fast still by just pumping out damage. I currently wear every piece of Enmity + you can get for every action I use to maintain monster focus but when melee reach the same cap that I am at its a crap shoot at that point.
    RUN... NIN... come on, you left 2 tanks out ¬.¬
    (0)

  5. #25
    Player Aramaic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    29
    Character
    Aramaic
    World
    Lakshmi
    Main Class
    DRG Lv 99
    Sorry didn't mean to slight those two jobs. But the majority of game content is multi mob tanking which pld thirves at better do to how shields work. Just annoyed that once melee catch up to cap there is no way for us to keep mob from rotating around a lot since we don't have higher caps.
    (0)

  6. #26
    Player Damane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    715
    Character
    Damane
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    DNC Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Aramaic View Post
    Sorry didn't mean to slight those two jobs. But the majority of game content is multi mob tanking which pld thirves at better do to how shields work. Just annoyed that once melee catch up to cap there is no way for us to keep mob from rotating around a lot since we don't have higher caps.
    where is multitanking? if you mean SCNM20 + 10 multi tanking, have done that on RUN too without much trouble on tough duo with a RDM friend, so very tough shoulnt be an issue its just a waste of time, thats an easy multi tank. the only multi tank BC that is dangerous is YXZ shikarae fight on tough and Divine might 2 for tanks that arent pld. the majority of the game content is single mob tanking.
    (0)
    Last edited by Damane; 07-21-2014 at 05:15 AM.

  7. #27
    Player
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    1,542
    Quote Originally Posted by Aramaic View Post
    Camate wouldn't the simplest solution be for Pld to have a higher enmity cap than every other job. I mean if the Dev's truly want Pld to be the job for tanking purposes. Increasing the gear cap doesn't do shit when the cap will still be the same for melee who reach it insanely fast still by just pumping out damage. I currently wear every piece of Enmity + you can get for every action I use to maintain monster focus but when melee reach the same cap that I am at its a crap shoot at that point.
    That would be simple but would completely defeat the enmity system as well. It's supposed to be a give and take to get/keep it. Being able to just sit at a higher cap would reduce tanking into just getting capped, turtling/enmity gearing up and keeping up basic defensive buffs.

    The flaw in the system currently (well has been since 75) is the cap. Largely it's because of how dmg enmity is calculated. Since with our current system it's just level multiplier X dmg. This sets up really dumb things like not being able to cap at all from dmg on low hp mobs and reaching the cap after doing 1% dmg.

    I mean if you think about it enmity is how much of a threat a mob considers you so there is no reason why dmg should be that static. I mean what mob would consider someone that took off 1% just as much of a threat as another mob considers someone who did took off 90%? Is that stubbed toe really just as big of a threat than someone spamming flash all day everyday or the guy who did 50% to the same mob but hey everybodies capped
    (2)

  8. #28
    Community Rep Camate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,712
    Hello, everyone!

    The development team has been discussing the current situation of enmity as it relates to battle balance and they have quite a bit of adjustments planned in addition to the ones mentioned yesterday in the job adjustments announcement for the August version update. So with that said, I’d like to reiterate those adjustments as well as share other planned adjustments in one nice post about enmity.
    • Enmity overall
      In the August version update we will be doubling the enmity cap for enmity generated through job abilities, magic spells, equipment, and other avenues.

    • Paladin
      We’ll be making adjustments to certain paladin abilities so that the amount of enmity accrued is increased in the August version update. Along with the increase enmity cap, we feel this should make it much easier to maintain your target.

    • Rune fencer
      While we do not have any plans at the moment to make adjustments to rune fencer’s abilities in the same way we will for paladin, we would like to look into adjustments based on feedback after the August version update.

    • Ninja
      As mentioned previously, we will be making adjustments to dual wield in the future. We feel that these adjustments will allow ninjas to use weapon skills more frequently which will allow them to generate enmity more easily.

    • Other jobs
      In regards to adjustments or the addition of abilities that allow you to shed enmity, we do not have plans to give this type of ability to all damage dealing jobs.

      However, when it comes to thief, they are able to steal enmity from party members by using Collaborator and Accomplice, but they are limited in methods for getting rid of their hate. We feel that some kind of adjustment is needed for this.

      Additionally, similar to thief, we are looking into adding abilities to other jobs that will allow them to steal or reduce enmity from other players.
    (7)
    Devin "Camate" Casadey - Community Team

  9. #29
    Player
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    317
    Can you clarify something?

    When you say "the enmity cap for enmity generated through job abilities, magic spells, equipment, and other avenues."

    Does this refer to Volatile Enmity generated by these abilities or just the effects of +Enmity (like gear, I'm assuming it just refers to like Sentinel/Crusade/Equipment)? That's not the cap people are talking about. Something needs to be done about enmity. It's a terribly broken system currently.

    Also, NIN being able to ws more will do very little of anything once CE is capped. Something needs to be done about the whole system, not just a patch job. It's untennable to have PLD/RUN/NIN in content where you don't also have a lot of Rangers.

    Edit: When would you ever take RUN or NIN. It's really hard to generate any feedback when it's just so unlikely that someone would go RUN to anything.
    (3)

  10. #30
    Player Tennotsukai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    577
    Character
    Tennotsukai
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    BLU Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Camate View Post
    [*]Other jobs
    In regards to adjustments or the addition of abilities that allow you to shed enmity, we do not have plans to give this type of ability to all damage dealing jobs.

    However, when it comes to thief, they are able to steal enmity from party members by using Collaborator and Accomplice, but they are limited in methods for getting rid of their hate. We feel that some kind of adjustment is needed for this.

    Additionally, similar to thief, we are looking into adding abilities to other jobs that will allow them to steal or reduce enmity from other players.[/list]
    Please give blue mage an enmity down spell. Currently, we dominate hate gain through our spells. It would be nice if we could remove our hate somehow or dump it on someone else. You could always give hydro shot a boost, but I prefer a new spell.
    (2)

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