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  1. #11
    Player Cabalabob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    308
    Character
    Cabalabob
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Brightshadow View Post
    I don't understand why people want them to be damage dealers would you prefer to compete against the 18 damage dealers in the game, or would you prefer to compete against 2 tanks lol.
    I don't want it to be a DD, same way I didn't want SMN to be a healer when I was levelling it up, but fact is I don't think it works as a tank so I wanted to see how people thought it would fair as a DD.
    (1)
    Last edited by Cabalabob; 03-24-2014 at 10:09 AM.

  2. #12
    Player Blah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    427
    Well if that's the case saevel then the way they can maybe "fix" it is give it, erm physical runes (for lack of a better name) they would have to be quicker on their toes but like they could have them put up magic runes when the enemy is trying to nuke and enfeeble and then when they try to whale (yes I said whale) on them switch to physical runes...let me guess they have not even one physical rune right now right?
    (0)
    Please do not post if you are drunk, high or madly delirious from lack of sleep...HEY WHERE'S EVERYONE???

  3. #13
    Player Lithera's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    733
    Character
    Lithera
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    BST Lv 1
    The have no physical blocking runes. SE while snorting pixie sticks or w/e said hey let's make another tank that can tank the crap out of magic flinging mobs and then not put in any nms that stick to only magic and maybe physical auto attacks. So unless the end baddy to the SoA story line is like this it seems many a RUN get told to stand in the corner and look purdy while the mnks go all crazy on the mob's butt.
    (0)

  4. #14
    Player Cljader1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    492
    Character
    Colliex
    World
    Bismarck
    Main Class
    DRK Lv 99
    Hey Cab, once you get run to lvl 75 it'll turn into a tank. At early lvl's it is a burst DD kinda like a drk but once you get your merit JA's "Inspiration and Battuta" and your full compliment of spells it will tank.
    (1)

  5. #15
    Player Raging_Oracle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    32
    Character
    Warmage
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    RUN Lv 99
    Well DD-wise you lose to any natural dual-wielder, you swing to slow -even with haste, you have no double attack traits, you cant counter -which when I google or youtube "fencer" it sure looks like they parry -> counter a whole lot, you don't hit nearly as hard as a drk, you don't tp like a sam.

    Get to much mob attention and you will see that you have almost the same parry proc ceiling as any other job with a high score in parrying - which when I google or youtube "fencer" it sure looks like they parry a whole lot -> counter a whole lot, functionally mnk blocks more than you parry - they numbers can say what se wants them to say but playing the job next to a mnk will show ya., a pld procs block way more than you proc parry against the monsters that count and thats even without ochain.

    I have tanked alot with the job, but people are so used to seeing plds 100% block rate or NIN 100% shadowtank that anything reasonably below those standards is considered a fail. That is SE fault. Now they are dragging there backsides the improve the job with garbage additions. VP -- gimme a break that what whm is for. Swipe - gimmie a break that's what ele magic is for. let me stop.. don't get me started on this in your post OP. Im so disappointed in SE for releasing this job and not fixing it to handle mobs in the expansion for which it was released.

    DD: average - drg, war, drk, mnk , dnc, good nin, thf with range, any ranger with a pulse, smn, blu, blm, sam, will destroy you parse-wise if they have any sort of skill.

    Tank: average 10 years ago, below average today - but I will say this- it works very well in then new skirmish area, they purposefully placed single element mobs in there and that is its niche. Your still not gonna solo imps that matter since they were ridiculous and failed to provide at least the same mdb traits that whm enjoy.. go figure that .. magic tank with subpar mdb traits.
    (0)
    Last edited by Raging_Oracle; 03-28-2014 at 11:20 AM.

  6. #16
    Player Reaper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    34
    Character
    Thereaper
    World
    Sylph
    Main Class
    DRK Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Raging_Oracle View Post
    Well Your still not gonna solo imps that matter since they were ridiculous and failed to provide at least the same mdb traits that whm enjoy.. go figure that .. magic tank with subpar mdb traits.
    rune gets 22 mdb whm get 20 mdb >.> atleast last I checked it did
    http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/115...=1#post5657419
    did this change?
    (1)

  7. #17
    Player Babekeke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Windurst
    Posts
    2,273
    Quite frankly, at 39 the only way that you can tank is by subbing WAR for voke, but your def is terrible, your eva isn't brilliant and you have no shadows, so there's not much point in you taking hate. After 45, you get flash, so you can make a fair tank by subbing NIN. Your eva is much higher than PLDs and you have a good parry rate, so with shadows, you won't take much damage. As levels get higher, you'll also find yourself on plenty of fast cast gear, making shadows easier to maintain. But the core of the matter is, as Sevael said, that RUN is designed for a certain niche of mobs, and you just don't encounter them whilst levelling. Maybe goblins, you're useful for AOE fire defence, or vs crabs/pugs AOE water def, but it's not game-changing.
    At 70 you can try seigan tanking as /SAM, but it can be unreliable. Rampage probably offers better Damage than any GS WS as well, though my axe skill was fairly terrible when I levelled RUN so I don't know what weapons are available.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raging_Oracle View Post
    DD: average - drg, war, drk, mnk , dnc, good nin, thf with range, any ranger with a pulse, smn, blu, blm, sam, will destroy you parse-wise if they have any sort of skill.
    Am I missing something? I just got back from a 4 month break. I've been a THF main for about 8 years now, and apart from when the merit WS first came out and I messed about with Last Stand for a bit before deciding that there are far few reasons to use /ra on THF except for status bolts, I've never used ranged on THF for DD purposes.
    (0)

  8. #18
    Player Kaiichi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Windurst
    Posts
    150
    Character
    Kaiichi
    World
    Bismarck
    Main Class
    DRG Lv 99
    I read through this form, as well as taken RUN to 99 and have acquired 4/5 of my AF. I don't think anyone really knows how RUN is actually supposed to work just yet, even after a year. I personally feel that t should have healing magic, or a few more levels of there chakra type rune thingy to heal HP. I also would Like to see those Physical Rune come to light. SE had come foreword to say that thy had hoped we would adopt NIN or SAM as a sub, But w/o provoke, I really don't see it happening. I personally like the whole perry god thing, but even that is a bit lack luster compared to using a shield. As fr enmity, maybe a good fix would be having Runes actually generate more, that way we could use /SAM and ride segin. Again this is just my view on the matter, respond accordingly.
    (1)
    Warning: You have the right to remain silent. Anything you do or say will be misunderstood, misworded, misquoted, and then used against you. For this is the law of the interwebs.

  9. #19
    Player Kanryu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    8
    Character
    Charade
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    WHM Lv 99
    I can tell you for sure I just tanked a 6 man Marjami and Kamihr delve RUN/BLU. It is not only doable but easily possible. Phalanx + Cocoon + Minne5 + Scherzo provide a fairly significant amount of damage mitigation to physical if you would be hit at all with Battuta, Swordplay, and Foil.

    Actual threat management is not even a little bit of an issue with the ability to reach the 80% fast cast cap. You can easily spam high threat spells, Flash, Foil, Blank Gaze, Jettatura. Not to mention Gambit/Rayke/Lunge/Swipe/OneforAll have ridiculous spike emnity. We may well have the best AoE threat generation in the entire game between Poison Breath, Soporific, and Sheep Song. If you really felt the need you could even toss on a Great Axe and Fell Cleave.

    Even /DRK is viable the same way it once was with NIN/DRK so long ago. Granted your spell choices are different now, but you will still be able to spam Foil, Flash, Stun and Drain/Aspir. Not to mention it gives you some Absorbs including TP.

    /SAM is the DD sub. You CAN tank on it for sure with Decoy Shot setup. Seigan will give you a decent bit of mitigation and Foil/Phalanx will have to cover the rest.

    As for the healing aspect... you don't need it. That is what you have mages for. If you ever feel like you need to heal yourself because you are going to die... get better mages. Sorry but thats all I got. Embolden Regen4 can go a long way to mitigate what little regular melee hits you take but if you end up taking big TP moves to the face... the healer has gotta be on that. PLD does not solo heal itself in any event so why should RUN.

    This job is not meant to be PLD/DNC go solo all the things. It is what it is, and its quite good at the role they originally defined it as with the sole exception of things that use multiple elements of magic at a time... which none of the new delves do. You can even tank some of the AAs on RUN without too much issue. I know for a fact Cloudsplitter is mitigated very heavily be Tellus, and that you can Pflug + Tenebrae to prevent the charm on the AA MR. I haven't gotten the chance to test on any of the others but I'd bet the overall effect is similar with the exception of TT changing elements at random.
    (1)

  10. #20
    Player Cabalabob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    308
    Character
    Cabalabob
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    About the physical runes ideas flying around, I had an idea a while back that would keep RUN a magic tank while also making them able to deal with physical auto attacks competently. Cause let's face it, this game is not designed for a magic tank, even the elementals use physical attacks! In ffxiv if a mob is a Mage it's a Mage, it spams magic and nothing else, RUN would be right at home in ffxiv. But this isn't the case in ffxi.

    So I had a thought, instead of physical runes. How about a low level effusion maybe level 30? that does no damage, but adds the element of your first harboured rune to the enemy to replace their auto attack.

    So for example. You could have 1 earth rune and 1 wind rune harboured then use this ability, the earth rune would be used and make the enemies auto attacks earth based elemental damage instead of physical. So your harboured wind rune would then lower the damage received from the enemy auto attacks.

    It wouldn't effect special attacks so foil would still be useful on that front. And maybe make it generate enmity or something.. RUN needs a low level hate tool.
    (1)
    Last edited by Cabalabob; 05-01-2014 at 01:47 AM.

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