Page 1 of 10 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 92
  1. #1
    Player Damane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    715
    Character
    Damane
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    DNC Lv 99

    The struggle of Supporter Jobs other then BRD

    This goes out to the Devs out there, because GEOs and CORs (more so GEO) are struggling to compete against BRD in terms of the support job place in PTs. Especially anythign that doesnt involve alliance content, since in "most" cases there is only place for 1 support job in 1 PT groups
    This is due to 2 things mostly: BRDs have Scherzo and Marches.

    Pls make all 3 Support jobs desirable in any spot by doing the following changes:

    CORs:
    - Implement a Runeist's Roll that cuts down sever Damage surpassing 75% of your HP (Scherzo equivalent/mirror)
    - Implement a Geomancer's Roll that gives MAGICAL Haste to PT members (or swap an old roll out for it, whatever)
    - Reduce Phantom roll recast to 10 sec for situations ith lots of dispel and being able to adjust easy


    GEO:
    This ones needs a bit more fixing, GEO struggles with any content as buffer where their luopans die because of one hit (AAs very difficult, list goes on) and where the PT is more dynamic (aka wandering aroudn changing position)

    - Make the Indi spells castable on other PT member besides yourself (still limiting it to 1 Indi spell)
    Reason: Avoid the Danger of haveing to stand near mobs that can literally one shot you if you are swapign gear out and arent /nin ¬.¬, makes also moveing around easier
    - Make the Luopan pet auto follow the PT member you casted in on or the Monster you casted it on.
    Reason: this would allow for a more dynamis play, and less static, changing positions wouldnd be bad
    - Implement a Indi/Geo Spell that mirrors Scherzo
    - Implement a Indi/Geo Spell that gives Magical Haste.
    - Last: freaking give luopans like -90% DT, like seriously, luopans dont deal any damage (outside of poison which is laughable and if you let it explode), there is NO reason our Luopans should take that much damage when it doesnt even deal damage to mobs or take any hate of them.... FLAW of design.


    AND LAST: make songs/rolls instantly wear off as soon as the COR or BRD leaves the PT. no more bullshit PT rotations.


    /rant off.

    Seriously, make them supporters close to equal!
    (14)
    Last edited by Damane; 03-03-2014 at 07:43 PM.

  2. #2
    Player Selindrile's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    628
    Character
    Selindrile
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    BLU Lv 99
    Better yet, make Bard songs and Cor Buffs alliance wide but make it to where you can have no more than 5 Rolls, 5 Songs on at any given time. (2 Bards can still go in alliance content, don't have to rotate, just may have to make more creative use of Pianissimo/watch positioning more, but still better than rotating) I say 5 because that's the max a single bard could get 2hr+Maxxed Daur.

    Also, all good suggestions IMO, but I still don't think this is enough to justify using a GEO over something else in 6 man content.
    (0)

  3. #3
    Player
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    166
    I agree, Geomancer does require adjustment but the concept around Geomancer is positioning so I don't exactly feel that Geomancers should be able to bestow their "Indicolure" spells onto other people; however, that doesn't mean that Geomancers are screwed there are plenty of ways that SE can still adjust Geomancers to bring them up to par with the other enhancers. Here is a overview of the problems Geomancers suffer from.

    1.) Outrageous MP costs!
    One of the major problems with the job is the MP costs of BOTH "Indicolure & Geocolure spells". When we look at both Corsairs and Bards you see that Geomancers have the biggest disadvantage out of the three enhancers which is our resource "MP" while understandably as mages its logical to use MP for our enhancements I think the MP costs should be reevaluated and drastically reduced, because when you look at both Corsairs and Bards they get their enhancements for free. And that's not all due to our MP costs hindering us we avoid our secondary role in order to manage our MP more wisely. If SE wants Geomancers to nuke while enhancing the party they need to really get this fixed.

    2.) Attaching Luopans
    Our second biggest problem is our Luopans while I do see what SE wants to do with Geomancer by making our position important, I just don't feel its feasible in the current world of vana'diel due to the fast pace movements of parties, so i'm not really saying they should remove the HP bar from our luopans or anything like that, but I do believe that luopans should have a way of following a selected party member. A solution I have for this is basically a job ability with a short recast (15 seconds) that would allow us to command our luopan to follow a party member. This would also make many of our debuffs like gravity much better.

    3.) 2 Enhancements vs 4~6 Enhancements
    While Corsairs and Bards are limited to 2 to 3 enhancements per person they are actually able to provide double the amount of enhancements that Geomancers are capable of because we rely on generated effects that are stuck in the location we cast them so unlike our competition we cannot provide 2 different enhancements to each side of the field. Here is an idea I got from another game that I think would be perfect for Geomancers if you ever played a Discipline Priest in World of Warcraft you will see that these priest are able to provide single target bubbles that provide enhancements, basically I think an ability that allows us to provide a third enhancement in this form would greatly benefit the job because we would be able to provide 2 enhancements to the frontlines or backlines and we can in essense provide the third buff to either the healer or paladin. Usually in parties there is only 1 person in the backlines, and in rare situations there is a mage party with a tank, so I can see plenty of uses for this ability.

    These are major problems
    (4)
    Last edited by Brightshadow; 03-03-2014 at 11:55 PM.

  4. #4
    When it comes to GEO, 2 buffs is simply not enough, at least not in their current state. I'm not sure why everyone is so against GEO getting 4 spells, because at the moment it is undeniably the ultimate afk job. It has virtually 0 depth; cap skills, stack magic acc, get some refresh gear, and even in AF1 you are 95% as good as the best geared GEO. Delve for many NA groups makes use of 2 GEOs, because 4 spells is what it takes for them to be worth using. This is all the more apparent in non-alliance content, where there is no combination of geo buff/debuffs that would make anyone think twice about using it. A BRD with no special instruments can still give 7 songs minimum; 2 marches, 2 ballads, elegy, nocturne, requiem. A BRD with 90 Daurdabla contributes 11 songs with Clarion Call. Cor can give 4 rolls, 2 caster and 2 DD.

    Even with just the current spells (i.e. no imaginary Geo-haste), 3 slots would let you give enough buffs to be somewhat worthwhile. Indi-Fury + Indi-Precision + Geo-Torpor, as a coarse example, would make you comparable to a BRD giving 2 Madrigals and a Minuet. In its current state, GEO is a bore to play and simply a necessary evil in alliance content.

    On a side note, it's rather funny that RDM isn't even mentioned in your post. It's so weak and unwanted that it's not even a support job in the minds of most players.
    (3)

  5. #5
    Player
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    166
    Quote Originally Posted by AppropriateName5786 View Post
    When it comes to GEO, 2 buffs is simply not enough, at least not in their current state. I'm not sure why everyone is so against GEO getting 4 spells, because at the moment it is undeniably the ultimate afk job. It has virtually 0 depth; cap skills, stack magic acc, get some refresh gear, and even in AF1 you are 95% as good as the best geared GEO. Delve for many NA groups makes use of 2 GEOs, because 4 spells is what it takes for them to be worth using. This is all the more apparent in non-alliance content, where there is no combination of geo buff/debuffs that would make anyone think twice about using it. A BRD with no special instruments can still give 7 songs minimum; 2 marches, 2 ballads, elegy, nocturne, requiem. A BRD with 90 Daurdabla contributes 11 songs with Clarion Call. Cor can give 4 rolls, 2 caster and 2 DD.

    Even with just the current spells (i.e. no imaginary Geo-haste), 3 slots would let you give enough buffs to be somewhat worthwhile. Indi-Fury + Indi-Precision + Geo-Torpor, as a coarse example, would make you comparable to a BRD giving 2 Madrigals and a Minuet. In its current state, GEO is a bore to play and simply a necessary evil in alliance content.

    On a side note, it's rather funny that RDM isn't even mentioned in your post. It's so weak and unwanted that it's not even a support job in the minds of most players.
    The reason they don't do anything else is because there spells cost so much, Geomancers are supposed to nuke after buffing the party, but they do need to be able to provide more enhancements because they are like 50% weaker than Corsairs when it comes to buffing. I think the reason SE hasn't allow us to provide 3 or 4 enhancements is because these bubbles cause alot of lag so imagine 3 or 4 bubbles in the field from one Geomancer, and imagine a party of Geomancers providing 3 to 4 enhancements.
    (0)

  6. #6
    Player Damane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    715
    Character
    Damane
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    DNC Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by AppropriateName5786 View Post
    When it comes to GEO, 2 buffs is simply not enough, at least not in their current state. I'm not sure why everyone is so against GEO getting 4 spells, because at the moment it is undeniably the ultimate afk job. It has virtually 0 depth; cap skills, stack magic acc, get some refresh gear, and even in AF1 you are 95% as good as the best geared GEO. Delve for many NA groups makes use of 2 GEOs, because 4 spells is what it takes for them to be worth using. This is all the more apparent in non-alliance content, where there is no combination of geo buff/debuffs that would make anyone think twice about using it. A BRD with no special instruments can still give 7 songs minimum; 2 marches, 2 ballads, elegy, nocturne, requiem. A BRD with 90 Daurdabla contributes 11 songs with Clarion Call. Cor can give 4 rolls, 2 caster and 2 DD.

    Even with just the current spells (i.e. no imaginary Geo-haste), 3 slots would let you give enough buffs to be somewhat worthwhile. Indi-Fury + Indi-Precision + Geo-Torpor, as a coarse example, would make you comparable to a BRD giving 2 Madrigals and a Minuet. In its current state, GEO is a bore to play and simply a necessary evil in alliance content.

    On a side note, it's rather funny that RDM isn't even mentioned in your post. It's so weak and unwanted that it's not even a support job in the minds of most players.

    I think you have no idea how geo buffs are in potency, 1 geo buff is as potent as sometimes 2 bard songs together, so 2 buffs is really fine, its the problem of keeping those buffs up in your pt that is driving geo nuts and barely useable + the lack of haste buff and no scherzo buff really hurt the job.
    (0)

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Damane View Post
    I think you have no idea how geo buffs are in potency, 1 geo buff is as potent as sometimes 2 bard songs together, so 2 buffs is really fine, its the problem of keeping those buffs up in your pt that is driving geo nuts and barely useable + the lack of haste buff and no scherzo buff really hurt the job.
    So it's fine but it's not fine. I love these boards.

    And yes, I know how strong GEO buffs are. I just did a random search on my server and out of 1057 people a bit after JP prime time, there are 112 WHMs, 90 BLMs, 41 BRDs, 41 RDMs, and 8 GEOs. Yes, 2 buffs is perfectly "fine."
    (0)

  8. #8
    Player Damane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    715
    Character
    Damane
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    DNC Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by AppropriateName5786 View Post
    So it's fine but it's not fine. I love these boards.

    And yes, I know how strong GEO buffs are. I just did a random search on my server and out of 1057 people a bit after JP prime time, there are 112 WHMs, 90 BLMs, 41 BRDs, 41 RDMs, and 8 GEOs. Yes, 2 buffs is perfectly "fine."
    you clearly missed the point WHAT GEO is lacking.... read my initial post again pls
    (0)

  9. #9
    Player Blah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    427
    Ah sorry, while I do support making geo and other support jobs equal I don't support nerfing other jobs, that's been the problem all this time I believe, they make a job real good, people say " Ok how about fixing <insert job here>?", and SE says sure and nerfs the job they just made good. So I think to make them all great they should all be able to either buff limitlessly or ah if that is shot down (which I'm sure it will be) at least let them all have the same amount of buffs, and course let that bubble follow...I want to KNOW who is being buffed and who isn't which honestly I can't tell when it's just sitting there...with no1 by it.
    (0)
    Please do not post if you are drunk, high or madly delirious from lack of sleep...HEY WHERE'S EVERYONE???

  10. #10
    Player Sapphire's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    BACK IN BASTOK!
    Posts
    267
    Character
    Seigyoku
    World
    Sylph
    Main Class
    BRD Lv 99
    There is apparently a maximum number of songs, though I admit I cannot recall what it is at the time.

    However, with the way the game is coded at its most basic level there isn't a way they can make alliance wide songs (or spells). Spells are either, enemy, enemy AOE, self target only, party targetable, party AOE or "can target anyone." There is no "alliance only" setting.

    It's why dancers can Curing Waltz cross-party but not Healing Waltz. Curing Waltz can be targeted on any PC in range. Healing is party only. There is no middle ground as has been explained by the devs is the past.

    (Not saying there SHOULDN'T be an alliance level, just saying I highly doubt it will ever happen do to coding realities.)
    (0)
    Don't wish. Don't start.

Page 1 of 10 1 2 3 ... LastLast