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Thread: Vivacious Pulse

  1. #21
    Player Sekhmet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Windurst
    Posts
    31
    Character
    Sekhmet
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    DRK Lv 99
    It seems Pulse is boosted by the 'stat vomit' on your gear. Lets say you have gear on that gives you +100 Str. That same gear gives you +80 Dex (purely conjecture to show an example). If you used Ignis rune, which corresponds to Str stat, you'd get a higher Pulse then if you used Sulpor, which is linked to your Dex stat.
    (0)

  2. #22
    Player Peepiopi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    72
    Character
    Aoikaminari
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    RUN Lv 99
    imo, given how mana-starved rune fencers get since the don't have an auto-refresh trait, or an auto-refresh on futhark, then the mp restore function of the dark runes is the most useful.

    However, it's not practical to keep Tenebraes up for fighting since you may need elemental mitigations with the other rune enhancements. You end up having to throw 3x Tens up when you need an mp boost, then throw the 3x enhancements of the element you need again right after that. So they say they want to reduce rune enhancement spam (which i wholeheartedly agree with), but they're design choices are contradicting that.

    If the devs wanted to reduce rune enhancement spamming, here's what needs to happen:

    - Using Swipe, Lunge, and Gambit no longer consumes rune enhancements (there is already a long cooldown on them, so it's not like they'll be spammable)

    - Adjust vivacious pulse to give both HP and MP back regardless of what rune enhancements are up. Find a different bonus other than mana for Tenebrae, so that mp-dependency on it is reduced.
    (3)

  3. #23
    Player Cabalabob's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    308
    Character
    Cabalabob
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Ok I think I get it now, so the cure potency is increased by a stat that is assigned by the rune you use, except dark runes which restore mp aswell as hp.

    So if your highest stat was STR you would use ignis runes to assign STR as the modifier for cure potency.

    Is that the gist of it?
    (0)

  4. #24
    Player Kensagaku's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    652
    Character
    Kensagaku
    World
    Valefor
    Main Class
    DRG Lv 99
    Reverse that, but pretty close. Essentially, you want to increase the stat that is based on the runes you have equipped. Fortunately with stat-vomit gear this isn't too bad, though it will be hell on macros; you'd have to make one for each rune focus.

    Also, from a few tests I've discovered a few things. For a single rune type (i.e. 1~3 Ignis, nothing else) your value of HP increase is equal to 1/2 of the total relevant stat per rune. Say you have one Ignis Rune and 100 STR total, your Pulse will do its base amount + 50 HP. Two runes would make it +100, and three would make it +150.

    For multiple runes, however, it's not as effective. I tested using Sulpor/Ignis, and had an equivalent amount of total stat in both testings. The growth with multiple rune types was reduced in effectiveness. I expected a growth of 49 HP going from 1 Ignis to 1 Ignis/1 Sulpor with no gear, as my DEX was 98. 98/2 is 49. Instead, I had a growth of 44 HP, 5 less than what I had anticipated, roughly a 10% decrease in effectiveness that only grew as I added stats. So multiple rune types seem to have a slight penalty or something.

    And on that note, I've also tested Tenebrae, trying to figure out what increases MP gained. I've had no luck thus far because it's hard to isolate single stats and I don't have a ton of MP+ gear. I know there is something though because after all my testing with minimal/no gear where my MP/rune was +58, going back to full gear I suddenly got +62. Whatever the affecting parameter is, the effect is not very potent. That's only +12 MP with three runes and full gear than doing it with none, if it remains linear.
    (0)
    [Kensagaku - formerly of Kujata] - http://www.ffxiah.com/player/Valefor/Kensagaku

  5. #25
    Player Vivivivi's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Location
    Windurst
    Posts
    554
    Character
    Bananavivi
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    BLM Lv 99
    Did a quick test as well- my rune fencer has a lot of str gear, so with fire runes up, I got back over 500 hp, compared with 200~ with dark runes up.
    (0)

  6. #26
    Player Kensagaku's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Posts
    652
    Character
    Kensagaku
    World
    Valefor
    Main Class
    DRG Lv 99
    After getting some feedback from others and re-testing, I found that I was wrong; there is no penalty for multi-rune. I was under the incorrect assumption that elemental stat associations applied as normal, but as others have found, stats seemed to be assigned based on the JA list order compared to the stat order.

    So it's something like this:
    Ignis (Fire) => STR
    Gellus (Ice) => DEX
    Flabra (Wind) => VIT
    Tellus (Earth) => AGI
    Sulpor (Thunder) => INT
    Unda (Water) => MND
    Lux (Light) => CHR
    Tenebrae (Dark) => ???

    I wonder if it's a bug, since it's really just two pairs of reversals. Dex and int are swapped, and agi and vit are swapped. Maybe something to put in a bug report on to see if it's a "working as intended" deal.
    (1)
    [Kensagaku - formerly of Kujata] - http://www.ffxiah.com/player/Valefor/Kensagaku

  7. #27
    Player Mugly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    14
    Character
    Mugly
    World
    Carbuncle
    Main Class
    RUN Lv 99
    So I've been using Same Rune combos for pretty much everything for a long time, until I noticed something peculiar when I accidentally used Lunge with 2 Ignis and 1 Flabra. I dealt noticeably more damage to the enemy than I usually did with either 3 Ignis or 3 Flabra. I subsequently tried the same thing with my Vivacious pulse and again saw an appreciable increase.

    This led me to experiment a little bit, but I haven't tested very significantly yet. I tried out a bunch of different combos and it appears that certain combinations have a significant effect on Lunge and Vivacious pulse. I suspect it may effect other abilities as well, but I don't really know how to easily test those other abilities (Such as Vallation or Liement, etc .) I assume that in certain situations it's probably better to stay with 3 of the same rune, such as when fighting a monster that uses a single type of magic, or when attempting to defend from specific spells and debuffs that a monster might have. In those situations, stacking the same rune seems to be the most beneficial.

    What's really interesting to me is that it appears that you can keep one type up for per hit damage, and then quickly add in one different type before using Lunge or Vivacious Pulse in order to boost the results. This implies that it can be worth it to swap in runes once in a while, and it probably wouldn't interfere with setting up your normal defenses, since you'd have to redo your runes once you used Lunge anyways.

    I haven't seen an obvious theme between different runes-- honestly, it might just be that one rune was getting a better stat bonus than the other and that's why it was boosted more than usual. However, it -seemed- that runes that weren't in direct opposition to each other increased the amount more. Runes that were in direct opposition (i.e. Umbra, Fire, Gelus) seemed to heal less and deal less damage. Again, it might just be the way my stats were changing the rune boost values, but that is what I experienced from my limited testing.

    I'll try to get a better idea of what's going on with this and test it out some more. I'll attempt it without any gear on and with AF, Relic, and Espial/Wayfarer sets. Once I get my AF and Relic upgraded I'll test it again as well. (Or if anyone else has either set upgraded and could test, that'd be helpful as well).
    (0)

  8. #28
    Player Martel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    249
    Character
    Martel
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    DRG Lv 99
    Regarding Lunge at least, I'm getting very much the opposite result.

    Ignisx3 5353
    Ignis,Ignis,Gellus 4096
    Ignis,Gellus,Flabra 3369
    ignis x1 1123

    It looks very much like the damage modifier for having multiple runes up only increase when you have more than one of the Same rune...

    Single Hit Damage = ( Main-hand weapon Skill × (0.5 + Number of Runes × 0.25) ) × Magic Multiplier Terms

    Single ignis lunge, 1123. 1123*3=3369. Yeah. The number of runes is being counted as 1 when you have 3 different rune up. You still get 3 hits, but at the single rune dmg rate.

    It does not appear to be beneficial to lunge with mixed runes.

    I did very little in the way of pulse testing. But using mixed runes didn't see to make much difference.

    pulse
    ignisx3 527
    Ignis,ignis,gellus 525
    Ignis,Gellus,Flabra 525

    Same gear/stats for all. But I didn't really bother to check stats and see if I had notably more of x stat than others.
    (0)

  9. #29
    Player Damane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    715
    Character
    Damane
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    DNC Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Martel View Post
    Regarding Lunge at least, I'm getting very much the opposite result.

    Ignisx3 5353
    Ignis,Ignis,Gellus 4096
    Ignis,Gellus,Flabra 3369
    ignis x1 1123

    It looks very much like the damage modifier for having multiple runes up only increase when you have more than one of the Same rune...

    Single Hit Damage = ( Main-hand weapon Skill × (0.5 + Number of Runes × 0.25) ) × Magic Multiplier Terms

    Single ignis lunge, 1123. 1123*3=3369. Yeah. The number of runes is being counted as 1 when you have 3 different rune up. You still get 3 hits, but at the single rune dmg rate.

    It does not appear to be beneficial to lunge with mixed runes.

    I did very little in the way of pulse testing. But using mixed runes didn't see to make much difference.

    pulse
    ignisx3 527
    Ignis,ignis,gellus 525
    Ignis,Gellus,Flabra 525

    Same gear/stats for all. But I didn't really bother to check stats and see if I had notably more of x stat than others.
    he stated tough useing oposing elements seemed to reduce the lunge damage, you are useing fire fire ice, fire counters ice, try it with fire fire light (zomg fusion SC), well he used fire fire wind (both elements propertys of the light elementals sc), or ice ice water etc. however i really doubt myself that it will surpass triple same elemental rune lunge dmg.
    (0)

  10. #30
    Player Martel's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Posts
    249
    Character
    Martel
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    DRG Lv 99
    Ahhh, I did miss that.

    However, It doesn't seem to make any difference.

    Ignis,Ignis,Flabra 4030,4030
    Ignis,Flabra,Sulpor 3369
    Gellus,Tellus,Unda 3369
    Flabra,Flabra,Sulpor 4030
    Unda,Unda,Tenebrae 4030
    Ignis,Ignis,Unda 4030
    Flabra,Ignis,Ignis 3467(wind weather up)*,4030
    Ignis,Flabra,Ignis 4030
    Flabra, Sulpor,Ignis 3369

    I avoided using Lux since I was testing on darksday, and then avoided ignis once it hit firesday. So I didn't use the exact combination requested. But I'd think if there was a dmg bonus for using certain differing runes, one of those combos would have hit it....

    *Really not sure what this was... looks like a 3 different rune lunge with a wind proc on flabra... Maybe I just messed up and used the wrong rune..? But anyway, after I repeated it I got normal dmg.

    Also not sure why I'm getting 4030 now rather than 4096... But I'm inclined to consider the 4096 aberrant considering my 4030 sample size.(Did I move a piece of MAB gear or something....?)

    Anyway, I'm still not seeing any kinda damage bonus over using x3 of the same rune. Not sure what factor I could be missing at this point.
    (0)

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