New Jobs that can only be selected as Support Jobs

[Jinzha]

Here is a pretty simple idea that I think will be a home run if everyone takes a moment to read what I have to say.


My Proposal: Instead of creating support jobs based off of the LV. 99 version of a job, I believe that there should be completely new Jobs that function only and exclusively as support jobs

Support jobs have always been based off of the halved version of a real job

ex.) PLD 99 --> PLD 49
PUP 99 --> PUP 49
SMN 99 --> SMN 49



But, in a lot of cases, just because a job can be used as a support job doesn't mean it necessarily is useful as a support job. The examples shown above are jobs that are capable of being used as support jobs, but are not by any means optimal in comparison to other support jobs. They still can be useful in certain situations, however.

The point is Square Enix, I don't believe, creates all jobs equally with the intention of them both being useful as a Lv. 99 job and a support job. /WAR /RDM /NIN are all great examples of useful support jobs, but /BST /GEO /PUP can all be very questionable support jobs if you're trying to be useful in end game content.

If we implement job classes that are specifically meant to be support jobs, then we can cater to different jobs classes that don't have support jobs that necessarily benefit their job.

Here are some examples

Support Job: Medic - This support job can completely unique job abilities and spells from all other healing classes that help specifically with healing and conserving mp.

Support Job: Viking - This support job can focus on defensive job abilities, job traits, and spells that benefit close line jobs and tanking jobs like Paladin and Rune Fencer.

Support Job: Herder - This support job can give job abilities, job traits, and even spells that are especially beneficial for all pet jobs including Dragoon, Beastmaster, Puppetmaster, and Summoner.

Support Job: Berserker - This class can focus on job abilities and job traits that enhance front lines damage dealing jobs including Monk, Samurai, Dark Knight, and other classes. Job traits could be things like dual wield, enhances acc and attack

These types of support jobs can be "General" type support jobs that benefit a variety of job classes while also being a little bit more focused on certain types of fighting whether that is magic, meleeing, or tanking.

The idea behind these support jobs are that when they're unlocked, the support jobs do not need to be leveled, they can be immediately used and are always half of your main classes level. This means that when these new support jobs are implemented, no man time is necessary to create job specific gear or quest lines that go with these classes. They could be unlocked by purchasing the class from a NPC or doing a simple mini quest which would allow Square Enix to implement a lot of new support jobs that benefit specific jobs and class categories. The support job classes are meant to only reach level 49 (or whatever half the level cap is at the time.)

A next class of jobs exclusive to support jobs could be some of the more popular selections that the player base ask to have to have implemented as real jobs.

Support Job: Time Mage - Grants access to spells such as haste II and or hasteja, Slow II and or Slowja, Reflect, Gravity/Graviga, Stop/Break and could carry innate job traits such as Haste 5~15%, movement speed +18%. All sorts of fun stuff.

Support Job: Necromancer
This support job can give access to spells like death, high level dark magic, and other new black magic exclusive to its job.

Support Job: Onion Knight - Grants access to a large variety of job traits and job abilities such as provoke, sentinel, waltzes, meditate, steal, and even access to more general spells like cures, enspells, protect, shell, sleep (of course this could be powerful as a support job, but just an example of how the job class works). The job abilities and spells accessible at a given time could be similar to how blue mage sets their magic spells, so that you can't have every job ability from every class on at the same time. And the job abilities accessible can be more general so that other support jobs are obviously still useful.

Anyway, I think by implementing exclusive support jobs, players can diversify their support jobs depending on the situation and not necessarily be stuck with support jobs like RDM, WHM, WAR, NIN, DNC. Jobs like Puppetmaster, Beastmaster, Geomancer, Scholar, Bard that don't really have support jobs that really fit their job can have more options. And even jobs like Paladin who typically support /RDM, /War, or /NIN can use new support classes like /berserker to help them damage deal better in cases where they are soloing.

Square Enix can also implement new and useful support job classes without really worrying about putting too much man power into it. All they would have to do is create a few new job abilities and spells along with possibly some mini quest.

[Elexia]

While interesting they already tried that and found people rather have taken em fully - Scholar and Dancer were originally designed as 'sub only' jobs or jobs specifically designed to enhance main jobs through sub abilities. Necromancer = PUP due to the cop out of not wanting undead during the day since they'll only be 'useful at parts of the day". So throwing in Necromancer now would be weird specially as a sub only.

[Jinzha]

While interesting they already tried that and found people rather have taken em fully - Scholar and Dancer were originally designed as 'sub only' jobs or jobs specifically designed to enhance main jobs through sub abilities. Necromancer = PUP due to the cop out of not wanting undead during the day since they'll only be 'useful at parts of the day". So throwing in Necromancer now would be weird specially as a sub only.

I actually don't remember hearing anything about Dancer and Scholar being intended as support job only classes, but I can definitely see how they were modeled to be very beneficial as support classes. However, I don't think that the idea of creating sub only jobs should be dismissed just based off your point. If what you said is true, players decided they would prefer scholar and Dancer as full jobs instead of sub jobs all the way back in 2007 or even earlier (around the time WoTG came out) and the FFXI in 2007 is completely different from 2014 FFXI. I think the demands of today's Final Fantasy 11 are a bit different than back then and making sub job classes should be looked at again even if it wasn't as popular seven years ago.

Also my point of creating support classes like Necromancer, Time Mage, and Onion Knight was just things that Square Enix could potentially do with creating sub only jobs. Although creating these job classes would be a cool way to implement new jobs that everyone has always wanted to play without requiring much work on the development team's part, I think that it's more important to emphasis more general support jobs like the ones that I stated in my first comment: Berserker, Herder, Medic, and Viking (The names don't necessarily matter).

The idea is that by creating these support classes, players can sub unique jobs that augment more specific skills and fighting styles.

Support Job: Herder - If a pet job like Beastmaster or Puppetmaster wanted to fight a really difficult monster only using their pet and having the player stand back, there is currently no support job that would be beneficial to this fighting style. Sub /Nin, /War, and sometimes some sort a mage job like /RDM are about the only few options that pet jobs have that do little to help their actual job class. By subbing a class like Herder they could get additional job abilities and traits that could cure their pet and increase their pets attack and accuracy that would actually be useful in a situation where they're emphasizing more pet usage.

It's kind of like how Beastmaster can't sub Puppetmaster (BST/PUP) and use Repair to additionally cure their pet in situations where they need more pet healing, but if they created Herder then a BST could sub Herder (BST/HRD) and have that more pet oriented support job.

This same concept applies to all fighting styles, support classes could be created that may emphasize certain tactics: Curing, Damage Dealing, Tanking, Nuking, Support Line (Enhancing magic like haste, protect, shell). Jobs that don't have support jobs that necessarily enhance certain traits they need to work effectively could finally have more specific support job choices that optimizes their potential.

[Camiie]

I actually don't remember hearing anything about Dancer and Scholar being intended as support job only classes, but I can definitely see how they were modeled to be very beneficial as support classes.

They were designed as complete jobs from the start like all the rest. DNC just suffers from a severe case of hybrid bias when it comes to group content.

[Jinzha]

They were designed as complete jobs from the start like all the rest. DNC just suffers from a severe case of hybrid bias when it comes to group content.

Yeah I was pretty sure that they were intended as complete jobs from the beginning, but if someone can show proof that they were not, I'd be more than happy to see it.

Also it is a bit unfortunate that certain jobs really don't have a place in group content like Dancer, Thief, Beastmaster, Dragoon, Summoner, and Puppetmaster... There are plenty of other jobs that really are not as needed as they used to be like Red Mage, but I would hope that at some point Square Enix will do a better job to balance out jobs so that there really isn't a natural bias to what jobs can be used.

Players should be able to select any job that they think they would enjoy and be able to play it in all content, rather than choosing a job based off what will help them get into things like Delve and Arc Angel fights. The game's job class diversity is a little bit pathetic and this is what makes the game boring when all you ever see in group content is Bard, Corsair, and Monk.

Back before Treasures of Aht Urghan, WoTG, Abyssea, and Adoulin, the game was much more balanced and most jobs had at least some use or "advantage" in certain situations... Now some jobs are just rendered completely obsolete in comparison to others.

[Rwolf]

They actually were added solely with the intent of providing new support job options at first. This was confirmed back when Tanaka was on board during Wings of the Goddess and the first threads of DNC and SCH not being wanted endgame started popping up. They admitted they didn't plan out what DNC and SCH would do as main jobs at first because the main point was adding a way for melee jobs to heal themselves and mages a way to use magic more effectively when skills grades mattered without all this magic accuracy now. That's part of the reason why both, still to this day are really potent support job choices.

Ten Ton Hammer: On the surface, both of these new jobs seem focused around high level magicks. Is this true? Were the other "Extra Jobs" lacking in classes that heeded this particular style of play?

Gondai: The new jobs were not designed solely with high level play in mind. In fact, we focused on the low level aspects of the dancer to cement its position as a viable support job. In the case of the scholar however, the abilities and flexibility of the job become far more apparent at the higher levels of the game.

Link to full interview

They were specifically balanced and catered initially to be support job candidates. Of course that didn't mean they were what the OP is considering but enough to make a comparison. Now they are much more fleshed out in their roles. Scholar more than Dancer, especially when Scholar got a huge update all at once. Dancer to finally receive one of their own.

I agree though, by adding jobs that are just support jobs. Players will just complain until they are added as full jobs. It's too big of a carrot to dangle. I'd like to see them actually balance the 22 jobs we have now to be used as support jobs before expanding to supplemental ones.

[Camiie]

They actually were added solely with the intent of providing new support job options at first. This was confirmed back when Tanaka was on board during Wings of the Goddess and the first threads of DNC and SCH not being wanted endgame started popping up. They admitted they didn't plan out what DNC and SCH would do as main jobs at first because the main point was adding a way for melee jobs to heal themselves and mages a way to use magic more effectively when skills grades mattered without all this magic accuracy now. That's part of the reason why both, still to this day are really potent support job choices.

Well if that's not half-assing things, then I dunno what is.

[Shinron-PUP]

Here is a pretty simple idea that I think will be a home run if everyone takes a moment to read what I have to say.


My Proposal: Instead of creating support jobs based off of the LV. 99 version of a job, I believe that there should be completely new Jobs that function only and exclusively as support jobs

^ I'd like to see something like this implemented.

[bungiefanNA]

But how would you level a job that can't be set as main?

[Jinzha]

But how would you level a job that can't be set as main?

I tried my best to explain it in my first post on this thread, but I'm glad you brought it up anyway because it probably wasn't very clear.

When these support jobs are unlocked, which could be by doing some mini quest or simply buying the support job from an NPC, they will automatically be half the level of your jobs level. Therefore there won't be any need to level the job. It's similar to how trust npcs work. You unlock the trust NPC through some mini-quest, and they're the level that you are without any need to level them.

I think doing it this way is best so that the game developers wouldn't need to spend many man hours on creating job specific gear, job quests, and job abilities that would help the job survive on its own. The job would solely be a support job that enhances the functionality of certain main classes.

This way, players can have more access to specific job traits and job abilities that focus on enhancing certain fighting styles that can be gained by support job only classes.