Suggestions: Quality of Life Stuff and other suggestions

[detlef]

The only thing currently being argued against is Mythic weapon acquisition. CoP can be as easy as it needs to be.

Crevox just wants the game to be something it's not. When you join a game that's already 10 years old, you have to just roll with the punches and take what the devs give you (and even then, they've been very generous lately with the quality of life improvements). Have you seen the things he's been posting here? The guy doesn't understand the meaning of a long-term goal or content being locked. The guy complained about having to be rank 6 to do Dynamis for crying out loud.

[Lithera]

The only thing currently being argued against is Mythic weapon acquisition. CoP can be as easy as it needs to be.

Yes and how hard it should or should not be attained. Afania feels if even one part of its acquisition is changed that it will lessen her accomplishment in how she acquired it. It is how many felt about their completion of CoP after the caps being lifted. Also how she her self doesn't feel that anyone who if they do change the requirements would get the feeling of having accomplished something. Or just because something to her was easy but hard to someone else does not have the same weight. She also doesn't think these views could be seen as being elitist. Along with that this is a game and is supposed to be fun not a job. If this were meant to be a job then shouldn't we be paid to play?

I know the other guy seems to not want to be made to jump through hoops to get some things because they only want to be able to do the end of the journey or get the end result. This doesn't mean things in the mythic quest shouldn't be adjusted or not.

[bungiefanNA]

I am a returning player starting over. Even with my previous characters I never made it past 70 and I have never participated in FFXI's end game, nor am I in an hurry to do so. Here are my thoughts about the early game though:

1) Make Trust NPCs usable in mission fights. I want to go through the story *as* I level, not once I'm level 99. Makes the leveling experience much richer.

2) Make Trust NPCs usable for garrisons, and make garrisons soloable by a player with 3 alter egos (albeit with some difficulty). This would be a great introduction to group combat for new players. Heck, revamp garrisons completely -- so much you could do here.

3) Don't make low-level missions require sneak and invis. Specifically Windurst mission 2-1. This is a huge turn-off as a new player. There shouldn't be level 80 mobs anywhere near low level areas.

4) Add a mini-map (can be toggled on and off)

5) Clean up early-level quests. Some I've noticed are very finicky as to when they are available. For example, Windurst quests "Food for Thought" and "All New C-2000" were not readily available to me at level 10. Had to keep checking back.

I don't like that the lower levels are treated as a bland chore to be sped through as quickly as possible. I don't like that level 1-70ish gear is "pointless," and the idea is to get to 99 before you even bother with things like story line or quests. Personally I want to experience something other than FoV/GoV/repeat *as* I level, not once I get to 99.

**EDIT: Added #3

3) Grounds of Valor was added to make EXP gain at level 99 possible in any area with the activity, so they had to add level 80+ monsters to those zones. They put them off in far corners of the areas, not the main entrance. However, they did not relocate some of the ???s for missions, but many of the monsters around those are not set to Aggressive. Sneak/Invis is also nearly free from the 5 Tab Circumspection from any of the tomes, so it doesn't matter what job you have.

5) Some quests aren't by level, they're by Fame, which means you have to do enough quests and repeatable quests to raise your reputation with the NPCs in that town. You can have max fame at level 1.

Leveling is so fast. players have stopped holding on to low level gear because of inventory space limits. When level 99 is achievable in 24-72 hours, and missions may take longer than that, it makes sense to level as much as possible. Especially because with Abyssea, you earn more EXP per hour the longer you stay in the party, because of the chain bonus. MMOs breed players striving for efficient play methods, as many things are made to be time consuming.

[Blbelt]

3) Grounds of Valor was added to make EXP gain at level 99 possible in any area with the activity, so they had to add level 80+ monsters to those zones. They put them off in far corners of the areas, not the main entrance. However, they did not relocate some of the ???s for missions, but many of the monsters around those are not set to Aggressive. Sneak/Invis is also nearly free from the 5 Tab Circumspection from any of the tomes, so it doesn't matter what job you have.

**EDIT: Circumspection does not work. You have to drop invis to get through the cracked wall. So my point remains, Windurst Mission 2-1 forces new players to get help, level up a whm, or buy prism pots and sneak oil that a new player cannot afford at this point.

5) Some quests aren't by level, they're by Fame, which means you have to do enough quests and repeatable quests to raise your reputation with the NPCs in that town. You can have max fame at level 1.

The quests I'm referring to are Reputation level 1 quests with no prereqs. Some are just plain finicky for no apparent reason.

Leveling is so fast. players have stopped holding on to low level gear because of inventory space limits. When level 99 is achievable in 24-72 hours, and missions may take longer than that, it makes sense to level as much as possible. Especially because with Abyssea, you earn more EXP per hour the longer you stay in the party, because of the chain bonus. MMOs breed players striving for efficient play methods, as many things are made to be time consuming.

Completely understandable and probably unavoidable with old MMOs. However, this is just my personal play style. I like to stop and smell the roses. I will stop and camp lower level NMs, and I prefer to mix in quests and missions as I go. I'm not asking to change the system, but Trust NPCs in missions/garrisons etc would grant new/nostalgic players a richer, more varied leveling experience if they so desire.

Thanks for your response!

[Afania]

So Afania if I were to take your pov about mythics and applied it to something else say CoP you would of been in the same boat as those who cried omg they're making it too easy now that they took the caps off group, yes? Because you know that somehow killed their experience and hard work beating that expansion; meanwhile everyone who hit a road block because no one would help them get past this or that fight because they didn't like doing said fight shouted in glee when the caps came off. No more road block, no more needing five blue mages n a healer or w/e for this or that fight. Because you know you suck if you couldn't get enough of the correct job combo to win on a certain fight. Just because you were able to do something the hard way and others were not doesn't mean that if they lowered the difficultly of said event/quest diminished your accomplishment. The social tiers will still be there even if there are more mythics out there. Just look at the shouts for delve a week after it came out with all of the delve weapon or gtfo bs. Now it's please come this or that job in this or that sub job or gtfo. Certain jobs are being denied of clears just because they don't fit the optimal win factor thus forcing people to level other jobs just so they can get a weapon or armor they want from something.

This is a ideas that could make the game more fun for the majority thread again you might not like an idea brought up. If something is being asked for then it's obviously something that might be needed or changed. This game is 11 years old going on 12 and people want to put up ideas for the devs to look at and think about. Doesn't mean they are going to be implemented.

CoP and Mythic is not even the same thing. CoP is mission and required to access to certain areas, and it wasn't soloable until lv cap removed. Although I feel a pity that new players can no longer experience the epicness of it, I don't mind about it.

Mythic is ONE gear, out of many. NONE of the mythic are job changing to a point that you won't get invite without one. You don't need it to play the game, and it doesn't matter if you don't have it. Mythic takes too long does not hurt your quality of life because you can CHOOSE not to make one. Mythic hand to everyone = makes the game less interesting.

[Afania]

Yes and how hard it should or should not be attained. Afania feels if even one part of its acquisition is changed that it will lessen her accomplishment in how she acquired it. It is how many felt about their completion of CoP after the caps being lifted. Also how she her self doesn't feel that anyone who if they do change the requirements would get the feeling of having accomplished something. Or just because something to her was easy but hard to someone else does not have the same weight. She also doesn't think these views could be seen as being elitist. Along with that this is a game and is supposed to be fun not a job. If this were meant to be a job then shouldn't we be paid to play?

I know the other guy seems to not want to be made to jump through hoops to get some things because they only want to be able to do the end of the journey or get the end result. This doesn't mean things in the mythic quest shouldn't be adjusted or not.

Mythic and CoP is slightly different. Players do CoP because they need to do CoP to access to certain zone. In 75 if you haven't clear CoP, you can't do limbus, can't upgrade AF, can't learn spells. Most of the players do CoP for story, limbus acces, spells and so on. Thus making CoP easier to clear does improve quality of life, at the cost of no more chance to experience the awesomeness of it.

Most of the players do Mythic for trophy and long term goal, and only for trophy/long term goal but nothing else. I really don't know many people go after a Mythic because it's good effort/reward ratio, most go for mythic because it's Mythic but not delve/relic/empy weapons. By asking Mythic requirement cut into half, Mythic is no longer mythic, thus completely eliminate the point to build it to begin with.

I don't agree with this POV toward mythic being selfish/elitist. IMO, elitist POV= you must have mythic or else you can't play the job. My POV= it's ok if you don't have Mythic, you don't need one. What's so elitist about it? My POV toward Mythic is more about liking the idea of long term goal and social hierarchy, regardless of what group of ppl I belong to.

[Lithera]

It's elitist because you feel everyone should have to do something the same way you did. It is just like the people who told others they sucked at doing mammets because they couldn't get a super tank or four blue mages even though the person you are asking for help from has said job leveled. If you didn't need a mythic then people wouldn't have had R/M/E or gtfo in some of the early delve shouts or in void watch shouts. You only see relics around more because you don't have to be a slave to a dynamis LS anymore. You whining that if SE changed the quest even with making the beastmen nms pop more often is somehow going to cheapen the experience you had the feeling of accomplishing something hard to do. CoP used to be hard and many people felt like you do about mythics if they were to be even a smidge easier to get. That SE was slapping them in the face that now even the crapiest person on your server could get sea access. Does anyone need a mythic or a relic or an empy? No but if you have one I'm pretty sure you will get picked over someone who doesn't to go kill the newest wildskeeper reive. Specially if another person who might have better gear but not even a skirmish weapon for the job they're wanting to go on. No one wants to be the kid who no one wants on their team because they look like dead weight. Nor the kid who gets picked last because there is no better choices.

[Lithera]

People also thought having a joyuse or a riddle used to be a huge accomplishment along with having a maat's cap. Yet now you see people who have burned up every job to 99 with a maat's cap these days. Do you need one? No. It might kill the oooo factor sure, but you hear no one whining about how that should stay the hardest head item in the game to get forever. The game is changing and getting older and SE should probably do somethings to make it last longer. No one in this thread has said anything near the easiness it is to get your AF in XIV for mythics. There is no oh I think you should get a completed 75 mythic after doing the quest to break the base weapon for the weapon skill. That for sure would be a slap in the face vs asking for just a little of time spent being shaved off.

[Demonjustin]

So, couple suggestions of my own I haven't said anything about. Can we give rewards for extra participation rather than encourage players to do things with fewer people? I believe that Meeble Burrows was a great step in the right direction in that sense when you first joined us Matsui, you changed it so that more players meant more points, a system which encouraged bringing others with you to benefit everyone. Since this however the opposite has been true, many times it feels much better to do things with as few people as possible which isn't always bad but more casual things such as getting XP I believe should reward you with more rather than less, for instance we could get our standard XP and for each additional actual person we would get an additional 10% XP up to 150% total, this would encourage party play. Things like the Seal Drop increase, a higher XP reward for kills when in party, and other things such as this would heavily encourage party play rather than solo play.

[Afania]

I don't agree with this POV toward mythic being selfish/elitist. IMO, elitist POV= you must have mythic or else you can't play the job. My POV= it's ok if you don't have Mythic, you don't need one. What's so elitist about it? My POV toward Mythic is more about liking the idea of long term goal and social hierarchy, regardless of what group of ppl I belong to.

It's elitist because you feel everyone should have to do something the same way you did. It is just like the people who told others they sucked at doing mammets because they couldn't get a super tank or four blue mages even though the person you are asking for help from has said job leveled. If you didn't need a mythic then people wouldn't have had R/M/E or gtfo in some of the early delve shouts or in void watch shouts. You only see relics around more because you don't have to be a slave to a dynamis LS anymore. You whining that if SE changed the quest even with making the beastmen nms pop more often is somehow going to cheapen the experience you had the feeling of accomplishing something hard to do. CoP used to be hard and many people felt like you do about mythics if they were to be even a smidge easier to get. That SE was slapping them in the face that now even the crapiest person on your server could get sea access. Does anyone need a mythic or a relic or an empy? No but if you have one I'm pretty sure you will get picked over someone who doesn't to go kill the newest wildskeeper reive. Specially if another person who might have better gear but not even a skirmish weapon for the job they're wanting to go on. No one wants to be the kid who no one wants on their team because they look like dead weight. Nor the kid who gets picked last because there is no better choices.

Wow seriously you don't read right? I said "It's ok if you don't have a mythic", in what way it's feeling everyone should do the same way I did? If you don't want to do boring mythic requirement, don't do it. I've been advocating "don't do it if you don't like it".

Saying "you sucked at doing mammet" is elitist, saying "don't nerf the mammet or change anything about this fight" is not. Saying "you sucked at X" is bad attitude, saying "don't change" simply because he/she liked how it is atm.

I said NOTHING about changing king pop rate, NOTHING. I only disagree with alex requirement lower. You can keep putting words in my mouth.

I've never, ever seen "you must have Mythic or you can't join" /shout in my life, ever. "You must have RME/delve or you can't join" is not the same as "you must have mythic or you can't join". If you don't have Mythic, you can join with empy/relic/delve, so you don't NEED a mythic to join.

Only situation close to "you must have Mythic or you can't join" before SoA is DRG, because DRG using 2nd strongest option was way behind every other DD, it's an issue of DRG, not Mythic requirement issue. And this is no longer the case with 119 polearm.


Changing lving speed and Mythic requirement is not the same, either. You NEED to lv to cap to enjoy a lot of content in this game, thus speeding up the lving speed= more content for everyone.

Mythic is an equipment, it doesn't stop you from doing ANYTHING in this game, I see zero reason that everyone must have one. Again, if you don't think the requirement is reasonable, don't do it, nobody force you to do it.

A game should have variety of goal for players to do, some players like short term goal, so you can use lv to cap, finish CoP, obtain delve equip, obtain 119 AF as short term goal. Some people like long term goal, thus Mythic exist for that reason. There are only 2 long term goal in this game, afterglow and Mythic, there are many more short term goals in this game, which is pretty much everything else. Why are you trying to kill 1 out of 2 long term goals when there are only 2? All the long term goal fans won't have much to do besides afterglow if mythic requirement lowered.