RME upgrading...

[Clou777]

so... by the look of it to upgrade our RMEs we have to have a delve boss win... and i thought the increase to dmg would have been applied straight from the update, this is not going to help me get a place in a delve win once again because its still going to be the elitists shouting for other elitists and not giving anyone else a chance to get the KIs. Ive been trying to get tojil win for months but keep getting turned away because of little things like "your brd doesnt have +3 march intrument, you only have +2" or "your sch needs capped haste equip" or "oats mnk only" etc etc etc. its getting harder to find anyone to get you win these days because the people who have won only bring the people who also have won before and i was expecting to be able to straight up join with my empys to stand a chance of an invite.

[Leocon]

I thought I read you could also do the new BCNMs to upgrade as well. Perhaps I misunderstood though?

[FaeQueenCory]

Yeah......
I was really disappointed in the fact that they require Delve MegaBoss wins too...

I thought the whole point of the REM update was to make it so more ppl could participate in Delve.

Requiring a quest to iLvficate them isn't that bad... especially not if it's soloable...
But it kinda sounds like it needs a full 99+ pt...
PLUS the Delve wins just to start it...

Getting RUN AF1 after the first week was one of the worst experiences I have ever had in the game.
That's why I always join shouts for RUN and GEO AF NMs whenever I see them... because shouting for an entire day... and getting maybe 2-3ppl to join...
Thank GOD that SMN can duo those NMs... Cause if not, I wouldn't have RUN's AF.

Having an update activity is NOT a bad thing... In fact, it could be very fun! Who knows!!
It would have been better had the 99 and 99-II just poofed to 119s... Cause now I am HELLA confused about what happens to a 99REM that you wanna afterglow it... Cause if you 119'd it... can you then give it the afterglow???
I'm not sure if you can.... >_>

But having an update activity... that requires you to have done the event that you're doing the update to DO....
And then having it require full pts (as I'm pretty sure it was designed for... considering it's "99BCNM"....)...
That's a lot of unfun times after this week.

EDIT:

I thought I read you could also do the new BCNMs to upgrade as well. Perhaps I misunderstood though?

You need the KIs to be able to start the quest to start the upgrade...
So...
You need at least 1 MegaBoss win...
Just to flag the REM update quest....

[Leocon]

Well that is incredibly lame... But at least it's more options for weapons, I guess... and still more content. All in all I'm still pleased with this update.

[Demonviper]

SE don't get that not everyone wants to do delve. I know I don't & I don't see why it needs to be the only relevant content in the game.

Good to know there are more stupid hoops for E/R/M holders to jump through just to get roughly back on par though, when I saw this update was coming I resubbed to the game in hopes that SE have become aware of their mistakes and learned from them. Oh well, guess it saves me £10 a month.

[detlef]

SE don't get that not everyone wants to do delve. I know I don't & I don't see why it needs to be the only relevant content in the game.

Good to know there are more stupid hoops for E/R/M holders to jump through just to get roughly back on par though, when I saw this update was coming I resubbed to the game in hopes that SE have become aware of their mistakes and learned from them. Oh well, guess it saves me £10 a month.

Wouldn't it have been more prudent to wait until after this update to decide whether to resub?

so... by the look of it to upgrade our RMEs we have to have a delve boss win... and i thought the increase to dmg would have been applied straight from the update, this is not going to help me get a place in a delve win once again because its still going to be the elitists shouting for other elitists and not giving anyone else a chance to get the KIs. Ive been trying to get tojil win for months but keep getting turned away because of little things like "your brd doesnt have +3 march intrument, you only have +2" or "your sch needs capped haste equip" or "oats mnk only" etc etc etc. its getting harder to find anyone to get you win these days because the people who have won only bring the people who also have won before and i was expecting to be able to straight up join with my empys to stand a chance of an invite.

Few questions for you:

-What's wrong with having to do the current hardest content in the game to get the best weapons? You can't be bothered to find your way into an alliance to get a single win?

-Do you even have a level 99 RME? I can't imagine that someone with a level 99 weapon wouldn't have any connections or even be able to merc a win if absolutely necessary.

-Leaders demand MNKs with Oats because there are ton of MNKs out there who have them so they can be picky. If you can't bring that to the table you have to have a support job ready to go. +3 March instrument is hugely important for BRD, not just some little thing. As for SCH, only Apamajas II is a difficult to get. Everything else is just bayld, skirmish, empyrean, and relic gear. You can gear SCH cheaply; stunning is just a skill that takes practice.

[Demonviper]

Wouldn't it have been more prudent to wait until after this update to decide whether to resub?

I was caught up in an uncharacteristic bout of optimism I guess. I forgot to take into account the square-enix factor.

[FaeQueenCory]

Well that is incredibly lame... But at least it's more options for weapons, I guess... and still more content. All in all I'm still pleased with this update.

Overall... me too... sorta. (I'm on the line... But slightly on the side of "pleased" rather than "displeased".)

But making the REM update require Delve wins... kinda defeats the purpose of updating them entirely....
I know the devs made the REMs crap because they didn't understand the basic psychological attachment humans place on things they work on... (ask ppl who made their car about it and then compare to humans who just bought a car... look them in the eyes as they talk about it... I don't remember the term for this phenomenon... but it's connected to nostaglia.)
But having the update require the content that crapped on the REMs...

That kinda intrinsically defeats the purpose of updating them...

What makes me on the pleased side is that the 109AF1 aren't complete crap...
BUT they look like they require full-99-pts for their updating....
And are BCNMs...
I might have 300+ kindred seals.... but....
If it's the random drop like Limbus... (which is what it looks like if I'm reading the notes right)
Then getting the few pieces I want/need is gonna be hell if I don't get them this week. *remembersRUNAF1NMs*

EDIT:

Few questions for you:

-What's wrong with having to do the current hardest content in the game to get the best weapons? You can't be bothered to find your way into an alliance to get a single win?

-Do you even have a level 99 RME? I can't imagine that someone with a level 99 weapon wouldn't have any connections or even be able to merc a win if absolutely necessary.

-Leaders demand MNKs with Oats because there are ton of MNKs out there who have them so they can be picky. If you can't bring that to the table you have to have a support job ready to go. +3 March instrument is hugely important for BRD, not just some little thing. As for SCH, only Apamajas II is a difficult to get. Everything else is just bayld, skirmish, empyrean, and relic gear. You can gear SCH cheaply; stunning is just a skill that takes practice.

I can't speak for that guy, but updating the REMs wasn't about having the best gear in the game.

It was about letting more people be included in Delve, which is currently the ONLY endgame event.

To use your (and his) oats example, which is the strawman, requiring Oats is valid... it's not really different from requiring DDs to have REMs... except that's the difference.
With the REM requirement days, there's 3 different weapons that are roughly equal that are acceptable, this allows for ppl who can't make a mythic to play with everyone because they made a relic (you can exchange all the REM letters and it still holds true.)
The Oats requirement is a little harsher... because 1) it requires the content you're trying to do and 2) there are no viable alternatives.

The REM update, had it not required a Delve win (thank god it only requires one instead of all 3), would have made it so that mnks with a REM could join in and get an Oats if they wanted it.

More people playing on equal footing...

More alternatives to suit the player's taste. (to an extent, right Gungnir?)

The Merit WSs were a wonderful addition because it lessened the demand of REM-only, allowing more people to play together.

And this iLvfication should have done the same: lessen the demand that you've done delve to do delve.

It should have offered more alternatives to ppl to let more ppl be equal.

But instead it funnels the community again.

I have a delve win KI.... but I have no REMs... Should then I just be happy that I have my cake?
No.
Because I know that there are those out there with no Delve wins and a bajillion REMs...
I remember there was even a guy with all but 2 empys... all at 95 or 99...
Requiring Delve is the exact opposite of what made REMs good: The fact that there were multiple paths to the best weapons in the game.

Empy NM farming too daunting/mind numbing? Farm dynamis currency for a Relic!
Dynamis isn't fun for you? Camp NMs to make an Empy!
Alexandrite? Well you can still make an Empy or a Relic!!

But now?
Delve.
You have to do Delve.
You want to not do Delve?
Delve is boring for you?
Delve isn't fun for you?
Too bad.
You have to do Delve.

I only do delve for the gear... I don't enjoy it.
I would rather do Yorcia Weald Skirmish forever than go on more fracture runs...
Or Even do WKRs... because at least WKR doesn't bring out the dbags...
If I could do something I enjoy doing instead of the ONLY endgame...
I would.
But I need the gear from Delve just to be able to gear the jobs I enjoy playing.

And now... The REM owners have this same dilemma.
Ultimately.... this requirement to just flag the upgrade quest is bad.
Because it removes player-choice in how they wanna reach the endgame.

You wanna farm up a Relic?
You wanna camp up an Empy?
You wanna Alexandrite a Mythic?
Too bad.
Go do Delve.

EDIT: cause the post below...
It looks like there IS an alternative to trigger the quest instead of a Delve win.
Good.
Dunno how doable it is... but it's at least an alternative to Delve.
Even if it's using seals...

[Dragoy]

I guess I'm missing something, or do I simply read this in a different way when I think one needs not Menace Inspection (Delve)?

• A quest which enables players to reforge their relic, mythic, and empyrean weapons has been added.

  Attachment 8221Attachment 8219Attachment 8215

  • Prerequisites
    • Players must be in possession of a relic, mythic, or empyrean weapon only equippable by level 99 characters.
    • Players must either be in possession of either the detached stinger, flame-scarred skull. or craggy fin key items; or have cleared the “difficult” or “very difficult” version of one of the battlefields for which a macrocosmic orb is required for entry.
      * For mythic weapons, players must have viewed the associated event that comes with acquiring them.
  • Receiving the quest
    Players must meet the prerequisites given above and speak with Oboro in Port Jeuno (E-6).

    Attachment 8208

  • Items required to reforge the weapons
    The requisite items by be obtained by vanquishing NMs and boss monsters in Delve content.
    * These items may be obtained regardless of whether the NMs are vanquished in the field or within a fracture.
  • Obtaining items in battlefields
    These items may also be obtained as rewards in battlefields for which macrocosmic or microcosmic orbs are required for entry.
    * These items can only be acquired on normal, difficult, or very difficult settings.
    * The chance of receiving these items varies by difficulty level and type of orb used.
    

Here:

[...] or have cleared the “difficult” or “very difficult” version of one of the battlefields for which a macrocosmic orb is required for entry.

The new versions of the artifact armour look cool, but I don't like the idea of grinding for them Sacred Kindred Crests (looks like there's a mistake on the notes, about kindred's crests being required for them orbs). I never ever had a lot of seals/crests. >.<

I did get one from the first defeated monster, actually, but after 5 or 6, they stopped appearing! I guess it'll take a while to get 'em, but I still say thanks for reducing the time required for the next one to be found!

[FaeQueenCory]

I guess I'm missing something, or do I simply read this in a different way when I think one needs not Menace Inspection (Delve)?



Here:

[...] or have cleared the “difficult” or “very difficult” version of one of the battlefields for which a macrocosmic orb is required for entry.

The new versions of the artifact armour look cool, but I don't like the idea of grinding for them Sacred Kindred Crests (looks like there's a mistake on the notes, about kindred's crests being required for them orbs). I never ever had a lot of seals/crests. >.<

I did get one from the first defeated monster, actually, but after 5 or 6, they stopped appearing! I guess it'll take a while to get 'em, but I still say thanks for reducing the time required for the next one to be found!

Bluh.
I didn't notice that... so... Well good.

I can't say how "good" it really is...
Especially if it's basically a BCNM-delve-fracture...
But at least it's an alternative.

And for you, Dragoy, you can always do the exchange of 1=3 seal/crests/w/es
Even if that's still pricey...
(they really should have just used the translurry KI from Yorcia Skirmish for the AF upgrades... why did this have to be so damn complicated when we already had a "+1" system in place?)