New 1 hours

[Zephrose]

@Zephrose
From long before the days of FFXI, Red Mage was a hybrid job. A jack of all trades. They melee and they cast with equal effectiveness. If it does not fit that vision, then they're doing it wrong. If it doesn't melee it's not a RDM. Melee is as much an aspect of RDM as it is for MNK or WAR or DNC.

Then that's your vision of it from other games. In FFXI, it is also capable of doing melee but not at the level of other melee-centric jobs. It's your word that says it's wrong, not their's. Last time I checked, SE made the Final Fantasy franchise, not the players/fans. And have mercy if a player/fan base actually controlled an MMO... Man would we be %$#@ed!

[Zephrose]

@FrankReynolds

Your sarcasm is not welcome in such an expression and I hesitate to respond to this. However, if such a thing were to happen to the game where it would reflect a broken cell phone, I would just simply quit. If you feel the game has gone to this level, I would suggest it. I have yet to see it go to that level and still have friends I enjoy playing with. So really, it's not all bad atm.

[dasva]

I'm going to have to side with SNK on this one Demon. I believe your vision and SE's vision of RDM are not in sync and I don't believe SE is in the wrong here. RDM is still a very viable job to play but in a different style than it once was.

Like all things, change comes and goes, and this is no different. SE has nerfed RDM in the past and it was terrible then but people still found a way around the nerf to make RDM enjoyable and a solid job to play. One of RDM's greatest advantage over other mages is speed and it's durability. With these together, RDM can survive in most places a normal mage cannot. I still see RDM going in to delve all the time as a Silencer/Sleeper/Mage&Tank Supporter. Just because they have some fancy swords doesnt mean they will be using them all the time. Look at Whm... for years they have decent clubs and a great WS to boot... yet when did they ever have the chance to run up to use them?

I don't mean to tear you down or belittle you, I'm simply elaborating on the point SNK might have been trying to make in their post. We all have a favorite job and we all want to see it do the best they can to our personal vision. But in the end, it's not our vision to control. We simply play with the ball SE provides us with. If they say it's fine if the ball only bounces 15 feet when we want it to bounce 20, who's to say they are wrong? It's a game they provide us with, it's up to us to make the game happen and enjoyable.

The problem is while rdm is "viable" it's viable in the same sense that thf is "viable" as a DD. It does do the job sortish but is very much inferior. Just because people continue to use it doesn't make it any better.

While I could care less if rdm can dd (I mean it does have mediocre dagger/swd skill) but having the highest base enhancing and enfeebling skill should mean something but it doesn't now and hasn't for a long time. And why should 1 job have to work around nerfs while other jobs incorporate huge buffs? I'm all for trying to make the best out of a bad situation but part of that is trying actually fix the bad situation not just walk around it and pretend it doesn't exist. I mean really that's half the point of the feedback from these official forums. It certainly isn't just to shut up and take it like you suggest

Also your anology would be more like if we want the ball to bounce 20 feet, other balls end up bouncing 30 and one deflates. Guess what that is wrong

[FrankReynolds]

@FrankReynolds

Your sarcasm is not welcome in such an expression and I hesitate to respond to this. However, if such a thing were to happen to the game where it would reflect a broken cell phone, I would just simply quit. If you feel the game has gone to this level, I would suggest it. I have yet to see it go to that level and still have friends I enjoy playing with. So really, it's not all bad atm.

Personally I would attempt to have the cell phone fixed or replaced instead of telling the user that he / she needed to make the phone enjoyable. But, that's just me. You are an excellent consumer. Personally, I see this game as an ongoing service that people pay for based on their level of enjoyment. As such, it is in the best interest of the owner of said service to make it desirable and enjoyable to as many people as possible. Without that, there is really no point in releasing updates or having discussion forums at all. I don't see it as my responsibility to make them feel good about producing gameplay that I don't enjoy by making lemonade from their lemons.

I'm glad that you have friends that you enjoy playing with, but "Zephrose has friends he / she enjoys playing with..." isn't really a very good substitute for acting on customer feedback. For me personally, this game is like a dive bar that I go to because it has nostalgia even though there are much better places to go and I could see my friends any time. Recently though, they hired a bartender who waters down the drinks and a DJ that just plays mambo number 5 on repeat 24 hours a day.

[Zephrose]

The problem is while rdm is "viable" it's viable in the same sense that thf is "viable" as a DD. It does do the job sortish but is very much inferior. Just because people continue to use it doesn't make it any better.

While I could care less if rdm can dd (I mean it does have mediocre dagger/swd skill) but having the highest base enhancing and enfeebling skill should mean something but it doesn't now and hasn't for a long time. And why should 1 job have to work around nerfs while other jobs incorporate huge buffs? I'm all for trying to make the best out of a bad situation but part of that is trying actually fix the bad situation not just walk around it and pretend it doesn't exist. I mean really that's half the point of the feedback from these official forums. It certainly isn't just to shut up and take it like you suggest

Also your anology would be more like if we want the ball to bounce 20 feet, other balls end up bouncing 30 and one deflates. Guess what that is wrong

There is something innately wrong with that thought though. All sorts of games have different tiers of character/mechanics. Just because you want one job to be better at something that another job already has the ability to do it better doesn't make it wrong. Try looking at it from a different angle and see it for it's strengths. List out what the job does in each aspect and measure it's strengths verses other jobs. In the case of Rdm, it has a couple strengths over Sch I can already think of. As for Thf, it too has strengths over other DDs as well, however raw DD power is not one of them.

To openly attack someone that is defending SE for what they are doing is just shameful. All I see is bias opinions and unnecessary crying over something that isn't broken nor fully explored. Plenty of jobs have taken a hit nerf wise or had a job rise above them. You know what that's call in MMO terms? Flavor of the (time period)... An MMO is a ever growing and evolving system. With every iteration the devs push through, the game changes slightly. Players find new ways to use their jobs. Systems are used for unintended experiences. SE gives us a game to play and we play it. I don't make the game to play it... that would be asinine. No one would like it because no one would agree on anything. Which is much like what's going on now... A bunch of complaining because they didn't get what they wanted.

This will be my last post on the subject as it seems there is no reasonable argument on the subject. Later down the road you'll look back at this time and laugh how silly all this feuding was. Enjoy your time while you have it. Don't waste it on meaningless squabbling. <Take Care.>

[Okipuit]

Fly High wears off after 30 seconds on my character despite being advertised as a 45second ability.

Fly High's duration was originally planned to be 30 seconds and we have corrected the version update information to reflect that. We do apologize for that error.

We appreciate your feedback on the new SP abilities and we do have plans to adjust some of the new SP abilities and previously existing ones moving forward. While we can't disclose specific details or promise a an implementation period as of yet, we'll be sure to let you know as soon as we receive details. We're just as anxious as you are to hear more on this.

[Camiie]

Then that's your vision of it from other games.

No, that's what the job was. That's the concept of it.

In FFXI, it is also capable of doing melee but not at the level of other melee-centric jobs. It's your word that says it's wrong, not their's.

http://www.playonline.com/ff11/manual/index.html?loc=en
"Red Mage
Capable of using both white and black magic, and adept at swordsmanship.
However, mastering powerful spells takes far longer than white or black mages."

From their manual to your eyes.

Last time I checked, SE made the Final Fantasy franchise, not the players/fans. And have mercy if a player/fan base actually controlled an MMO... Man would we be %$#@ed!

If players and fans are such idiots then what does that make you?

[MarkovChain]

Thanks for all the feedback regarding Stymie.

While this may end up being a repeat of what was mentioned previously by Producer Akihiko Matsui, the development team feels that when it comes to the newly implemented seal battlefields, this ability is effective and has its uses.

I have done several very hard mode battles, and I'm not the only one to find that having all mage using elemental seal (hi) is the way to go, and you have to cast 4+ sleepga or lullaby aoe with capped magic accuracy, so yeah a single use of the rdm's SP2 is going to be useless :P. Players have already told why the abilty is gimp, and they prove it by using elemental seal on non rdm jobs (double fail).

Exemple : "divine punishers" very hard mode
MNK/WARx2 : only DD atm
BRD/BLMx2 : 2 troubadour horde lullaby II, 2x elemental seal horde lullaby II
WHM/BLMx2 : 2x elemental seal sleepga as backup.

[dasva]

There is something innately wrong with that thought though. All sorts of games have different tiers of character/mechanics. Just because you want one job to be better at something that another job already has the ability to do it better doesn't make it wrong. Try looking at it from a different angle and see it for it's strengths. List out what the job does in each aspect and measure it's strengths verses other jobs. In the case of Rdm, it has a couple strengths over Sch I can already think of. As for Thf, it too has strengths over other DDs as well, however raw DD power is not one of them.

To openly attack someone that is defending SE for what they are doing is just shameful. All I see is bias opinions and unnecessary crying over something that isn't broken nor fully explored. Plenty of jobs have taken a hit nerf wise or had a job rise above them. You know what that's call in MMO terms? Flavor of the (time period)... An MMO is a ever growing and evolving system. With every iteration the devs push through, the game changes slightly. Players find new ways to use their jobs. Systems are used for unintended experiences. SE gives us a game to play and we play it. I don't make the game to play it... that would be asinine. No one would like it because no one would agree on anything. Which is much like what's going on now... A bunch of complaining because they didn't get what they wanted.

This will be my last post on the subject as it seems there is no reasonable argument on the subject. Later down the road you'll look back at this time and laugh how silly all this feuding was. Enjoy your time while you have it. Don't waste it on meaningless squabbling. <Take Care.>

This isn't a want this is what the job has been designed to be the best at. I know the job and know it well and there is nothing I would ever do that would make it more advantageous to bring a rdm other than I want to because it's my first job and I like it. Let's see what does it have that sch doesn't some T2 enfeebles that will never make or break you. Refresh II which also wont. Melleing? Lol. Dia III? Light shot says hello. Thf has Th and feint.

Attack? I don't think you know the meaning of the word. I merely pointed out the flaws in your reasoning. Aren't you just complaining because you aren't getting what you want and that being mindless sheep just taking whatever SE gives them. I play the game because I enjoy it. When serious issues arise that are enough to stop people from playing parts of it I point it out in hopes of getting it fixed? What is your goal? Trying to stop things from being fixed? Sticking it to the rdms?

For once something we agree on though in seperate ways. I find it silly right now. I always find it silly that people complaining about complaining. It's amazingly ironic

[dasva]

I have done several very hard mode battles, and I'm not the only one to find that having all mage using elemental seal (hi) is the way to go, and you have to cast 4+ sleepga or lullaby aoe with capped magic accuracy, so yeah a single use of the rdm's SP2 is going to be useless :P. Players have already told why the abilty is gimp, and they prove it by using elemental seal on non rdm jobs (double fail).

Yeah I didn't get that excuse either... I mean who does 1 BCNM an hour anyways? And so far what little I've seen it's only use is on mobs that used to be immune to certain spells but can be debuffed with immunobreak now can be debuffed once with stymie. Like sleeping skeletons. So stymie basically seems kinda like a double immunobreak. However so far I'm pretty sure I've gotten 1/2 resists for all stymie ones while immunobreak I have gotten full durations so not quite as good as that. Seems like this really should've been a 5-10min ja that rdm got going up to 99 (especially since it got so little anyways going up to 99)