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  1. #11
    Player Mokeil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    140
    Character
    Mokeil
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    dasva and Umichi, thank you both for the input. I think I've got a better idea of where you guys are coming from now.

    Whereas the new stuff SMN has gotten is still kinda limited in its own way (in that magical attacks is only one aspect of what we do, and is still only something we can do every 45 seconds) it at least offers a dramatically measurable boost in performance. On the other hand, with the measly Pet:Attack options BST has been getting, you'll be lucky if you even notice the extra damage you're doing.


    Quote Originally Posted by dasva View Post
    Due to how oddly pdif works with pets as I'm sure you've noticed your smn melee dmg we need either alot more pet att (though crit rate da etc would be nice too) and I'm talking like 50-100 per peice on peices that also have other useful stuff like haste or like smn and pup have decent damaging tp moves with att bonuses on them lol.
    You know, I think this right here is the crux of the problem. I've definitely noticed a marked decrease in my avatar's melee power in Adoulin to the point where, even without all the new +MAB stuff, I'd likely find myself sticking with magic pacts anyways. And yet outside Adoulin the physical moves still trump the magical ones on most things.

    Traditionally, an avatar has always had incredible kill power on mobs that are lower level than it (often capping damage to the point where even crits didn't add any extra)... But now that level correction has been removed from Adoulin mobs, I'm wondering how much of that kill power has been due to it, as opposed to the stats of the avatars. I bet BST pets are suffering from the same thing.

    This strikes me as a problem with some very core systems of the game. New gear won't actually solve this. Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying BST doesn't deserve new gear - you totally do! It's not cool when everyone else gets new toys and you don't. All the same, new gear is just getting the same sorts of boost everyone else is getting. It does nothing to address the real problems facing our two jobs.
    (0)

  2. #12
    Player
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    1,542
    It is kinda a system problem... though because of how jugs are (almost all melee dmg and a few meh physical moves) it hits them a bit harder. While smn has usuallly been about the bps (heck often not even being allowed to melee) so can just switch to magical which got a rediculous boost over last few updates... also it's not just the pet mab though. The entire skirmish armor set and for that matter the staff gets up to -5 perp basically making free avatars with refresh afterwards a

    While the main problem is the pet or really the mob pdif system it can be mitigated with gear. Like releasing that 25 pet att does waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay less for every pet than 25 pet mab for the ones that use magic dmg. If they started doing more like +100 att peices and/or more like some kind of percent boost it would sorta compensate for the way pet pdif works. Well and of course fixing the acc issues. Hard to say without parses but I seriously doubt the ilvl weapons raise up jugs acc as much as it does the master. I mean very little acc gear with delve axe and I'm capping acc against mobs my jug is having a wiff fest on.

    Another issue is bst is a meleeish job so jugs never were (and argueably shouldn't be) hugely great as far as dmg goes on anything hard since you got the master deal dmg. Only now they basically do hardly any dmg harder stuff while master continues to be an ok DD so even using what little gear there is for pets will usually lower your dmg because they don't seem to like to put good pet stats on equipment that is also good for the master. 5 haste on my pet vs more for me or some other stats? Decision is easy in any situation but especially when buffed in soa areas.
    (1)

  3. #13
    Player
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    1,542
    Quote Originally Posted by Umichi View Post
    2k jugs are expensive.. but perhaps powerful? in the span of things they are getting 30 mins inbetween and any skilled bst can DD in lowman groups to get upgraded weapons and gear) and farming for plasm isn't to much of a hassle if you do 1-5 runs
    I haven't personally played with it but last I saw tested put it around similar strength of crabs in the past and current new one. Main difference is is that this one caps at like 113+ before beast affinity (though still need ilvl weapon). So right now it and the grasshopper are the only jugs that can get to ilvl 119 with grasshopper just barely getting there and the plasm one can do it without af2. So it is kinda nice. However I probably wouldn't spend 2k on it unless it gave me a full stack of jugs. Though I think one of the bigger downfalls is it dieing. Now that we basically have to merit beast affinity that means either demeriting killer instinct which is a huge dmg loss to the master and pt members or beast healer which lowers your pets survivability and/or increases the cost healing pets. And as soon as it dies bam out 2k plasm. So like if you actually used the plasm pet in a farming run it's conceivable that you might actually just break even lol. In the scheme of things you are doing alot of farming just for minor upgrades that die lol. It would be like if altenator litterally blew up ever 20th time you brought out auto lol (well other than the fact auto is alot stronger)
    (2)

  4. #14
    Player Goldfish's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    12
    Character
    Mysticknight
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    THF Lv 1
    @FaeQueenCory - Now while I understand the reference to SMN and other pet jobs were made (implying they are better than BST) but there's no need to put down our pet buffs.

    I mean if everyone kept doing that to each other's jobs, then no job would be buffed (in the scenario that SE listens) because everyone would have the mindset of <insert job here is entitled to this buff and not that job>.

    I don't mind (and would like too as I play also play SMN) if SMN also gets buffed too but there's no need to put down BST buff suggestions just because SMN is also not in a great place.

    For example, I always thought Avatar's Favor (when introduced and still now) was always silly due to the fact that it made your pets weak, the range was (and still is) really small at 10 range (compared to 15 range of most AoE stuff) and how it was rarely used or relevant to any endgame stuff (most people wouldn't waste a DD slot in the DD party for SMN buffs when they could rotate BRD/COR buffs and let SMN be in the mage party or something). Overall Avatar's Favor (for example) was (and still is) almost completely useless in any relevant content.

    I understand SMN's problems too and I hope anyone else coming to these forums can understand BST problems or annoyances that could be bettered. BST is definitely the king of pre adoulin content and still somewhat relevant in certain solo content too. Still, even if BST was the best job, it wouldn't be great or fun if certain things were left untouched or kept the way they are (beast affinity and jug pets being level capped for example). And FFXI is a game where fun should be had and every job should have many ways to have fun and/or have a variety of builds or ways to play (RDM tanking before they nerfed the enmity from sleep, dispel, etc for example).

    I think everyone should unite as a community and be okay with one or another's job buff suggestions (no need for nerfs for anything either). Besides, the game's kind of broken already with Adoulin. I wouldn't mind if most jobs got buffed.

    Edit - Also the variety of ways a job can play should also be increased. Back then, we had things like RDM tanking being viable (but died due to enmity values on things like sleep and dispel being changed) and other stuff too. I think each job should have multiple play styles (not that this is relevant to BST since I am fine with how BST plays) but the point is that buffing jobs or adding way for more jobs to do things increase fun which means players still keep playing. Please buff jobs and also add more gear or weapons that multiple jobs can use (I like T1-5 Delve weapons being usable by multiple jobs... it's neat to have Samurai being able to use bow somewhat proficiently too or ninja being able to use the dagger and sword for example). Again this isn't exactly relevant to BST but the point is that buffs and increasing what jobs can do (whether for BST or SMN or any job) increases build variety and fun (and that keeps players interested in the game). Things can be grindy but only if there are things to look forward at the end of the grind (being able to work towards a RDM tanking build for example, etc). This should apply for every job.
    (2)
    Last edited by Goldfish; 09-06-2013 at 02:19 AM.

  5. #15
    Community Rep Camate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,712
    Greetings,

    I have some information to share from Akihiko Matsui about adjustments to take place in the fall version update as well as future plans for beastmaster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Akihiko_Matsui View Post
    Matsui here.

    In the fall version update we will be making adjustments so that not only Lucky Lulush, but all rabbit familiars can use Wild Carrot.

    Additionally, I checked with the lead about other adjustments that are currently being working on, so I’d like to share with you what I can.
    • Addition of axes with item levels
      In the fall version update we will be adding new Bayld equipment, which include a new axe. The item levels for these new items will be between the current Bayld items (item level 106) and the equipment you can obtain from Yorcia Weald’s skirmish (item level 113).

    • Pet enhancements
      We plan on making adjustments to increase the attack, defense, accuracy, evasion, magic accuracy, magic evasion, and magic attack of familiars called upon with Call Beast.
    (8)
    Last edited by Camate; 09-07-2013 at 02:51 AM. Reason: Added "magic evasion" to the list of stats to be adjustment.
    Devin "Camate" Casadey - Community Team

  6. #16
    Player Kriegsgott's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Bastok
    Posts
    260
    Character
    Kriegsgott
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    MNK Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Camate View Post
    Addition of axes with item levels
    In the fall version update we will be adding new Bayld equipment, which include a new axe. The item levels for these new items will be between the current Bayld items (item level 106) and the equipment you can obtain from Yorcia Weald’s skirmish (item level 113).
    NEW AXE ? i dont think the ITEM LVL was the problem the problem is geting your PET on a high lvl !

    serously if you cant get the axe from Hurkan try it with all Nakuals seals there shouldn be a problem gaining a decent axe but capping your BST pet lvl is a problem or did i miss something ?
    (7)

  7. #17
    Player Mavrick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    107
    Character
    Mavrick
    World
    Bismarck
    Main Class
    BST Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Camate View Post
    Greetings,

    I have some information to share from Akihiko Matsui about adjustments to take place in the fall version update as well as future plans for beastmaster.


    My biggest problem with BST right now, is we went from having 20+ level appropriate pets with...

    - High evasion
    - Movement Speed Bonus
    - Multiple Elemental resistance
    - High Magic Defense
    - Berserk
    - Potent Aoe Paralyze
    - Aoe Sleep
    - Treasure Hunter II
    - Max HP Down-10% ability
    - Att/Def -33% ability
    - Potent Evasion Down
    - Killer Instinct Bonus for a wide range of monster families.

    To this..

    Crabs x2
    Rabbit....
    Grasshopper

    The moment I found out that the 76-99 jugs were all capping out at level 114 and lower, I gave up on BST... there really is no point to the job right now... there is nothing fun about loosing 20 pets and all the versatility they offer to level caps and absurd "level up" requirements that no other jobs is faced with.
    (9)
    Last edited by Mavrick; 09-06-2013 at 08:22 AM.

  8. #18
    Player Leonardus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    155
    Character
    Leonardus
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    BST Lv 99
    New axes between 106 and 113?

    Faizeer +1 (Item Level 113) is easy to obtain lowman, so that makes any axe below 113 either a tactical offhand, or useless.

    ...That second part is really vague and could mean almost anything.
    (0)

  9. #19
    Player
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    1,542
    Wild carrot is nice I suppose. The axe thing is meh. There is already enough lateral gearing that is higher as is. The raising the stats however drives directly to the point of me making this thread. Even with the higher ilvl the jugs fell behind other pets in soa... so assuming (holds breath) they actually raise them enough this time it could more or less solve the problem... at least until higher content lvl comes out. Especially if they grant the older pets that are capping at 114 to actually have a good hit rate and land debuffs and such. Could effectively make this thread a lie lol.

    Of course there is still the issue of the pets capping much lower than the content lvl so either needing to raise that or make more jugs. And ones that are more readily available
    (4)

  10. #20
    Player Estafio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    3
    Character
    Ironic
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    THF Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Camate View Post
    Greetings,

    I have some information to share from Akihiko Matsui about adjustments to take place in the fall version update as well as future plans for beastmaster.
    /shame on you guys....
    (2)

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