Wake up, "Seekers" is failing

[Tamoa]

Many people find a great deal of entertainment in improving their character, myself included, by believing that the next update will simply make your work pointless you unintentionally take away from the enjoyment because you know in your mind you believe what you just did only improved your character for a few days, or a few weeks at best, then it will mean almost nothing. Finishing something that makes a large impact, like when I finished Excalibur, that made me insanely happy and it was very entertaining to run around killing things with it for the first time. On the other hand if I knew that 2 weeks later the sword would go in my Sack and never be taken out, I would have never done it, and if I had finished it, I would have been happy and entertained but to a much lesser degree because the impact is much smaller, rather than being amazing and the best, it would be close to best, and above average. I would feel like my improvement was minor, and as I am entertained by that improvement, my entertainment is also minor by compare to if it were a large boost I knew would stay with me for a while, and stand out.

That's how I am at least.

QFT. Thank you for putting into words exactly how I feel.

[Sarick]

To me the seekers expansion ruined the game. They looked at other MMOs and tried to implement elements that worked for those in a world that was completely different. Before we had spaghetti and meatballs on the plate. Then the and crew saw a lot of people liked ice cream at another location down the road. In a genus attempt to make something fresh and new the team decided to replace the meatballs with ice cream scoops.

This is what happened to FFXI after the expansion. Although people like spaghetti and people like ice cream, some foods just don't mix well and FFXI has the case of mixing the wrong content. Item levels are garbage IMHO.. I'm not interested n playing anymore. My famely members are speaking of quitting and most of my friends on game gave quit or are on the fence about it. These choices aren't because the upcoming FFXIV. These are because the game has been ruined by the new direction it's developers choose.

When I hear people talking about delve << the first thing I see is developer. The moment seekers was introduced old content gear that I busted my ass earned was obliterated. After hearing this I'm like demon. WHY THE F'n should I work to improve my gear dong boring events so I can get stronger only to have it obsoleted a month down the road.

To me it's not entertaining knowing that all my effort s for naught. If I bust my arse getting gear and then the new developers make content that robs me of the usefulness of it in current content I'm not happy. Even though it's stil useful in old areas it's still telling me I WASTED my time and all that excitement I had is wash. At least when I leveled up and upgraded relic I knew that I was stronger as a character. Seeing as how gear is interchangeable as the new level up If they introduce new content I lose what I earned because it HAS to be replaced.

The truth about ITEM based leveling is it's way to ROB players of achievements. Look at it this way. When abbysea came out players had level caps raised. These new levels made the characters stronger. Everyone has EQUIAL opportunity to raise their levels and PARTICIPATE in the game. When you got level 99 you stayed level 99 no matter what gear you had equipped. The gear made you better and everything that was created for level 99 players worked you could have partal sets and still be manageable. When you removed gear you didn't suddenly drop to level 90 or level 75!

Now you level up by upgrading gear that on a whim will need replaced. MY GOOD WHO thought this crap up. I hate it so bad. It's probibly the wrose F'n system ever. You could've used the MERIT system or ways to upgrade or current gear or quest to upgrade the characters but NO you made us cram more crap into are bursting mog lockers and loath that we worked on RMES. I don't care if you decided to fix RMES you pulled a MICROSOFT on the customers.

Now if you want to participate in this game you need a lot of resources (time, money, friends) to get ahead and then on top of that you can't participate in new endgame content until to use their ITEM leveling ladder. This seperates the hardcore and casuals. Players who can't manage the complex tiered gear system that realise everything they acheave gets thrown out.

It's like re-berthing for level caps. You get to level 50 capped. To get to level 55 you need to restart to level 1 and level up again so when you get to level 55 you can start over at level 1 and repeat the process. All this to improve character. It's just a bunch of grinding on top of grinding where the mog house is so full of shit that it has become the furniture.

They keep adding more gear gear gear gear gear gear gear ~ gear and the mog space has always been a problem, and now that it's needed for your levels you MUST keep everything to maintain levels.

Seriously, I'm sick right now I want to PUKE thinking about how badly this game has been ruined I can't even articulate it in words. I'm going to end on that note because I simply can't waste my time explaining everything that the seekers expansion hurt in detail. It's just too much to explain. Right now I'm just holding out to see if the developers flip a switch like Microsoft did and the game direction changes to something I can enjoy again.

I doubt it.

[Monchat]

Even if you farm 6 marrows/2h run with 8(?) characters, that's ~3.75m/char or player/hour. A T1-T6 run is worth ~71k plasm, resulting in 28 airlixir+1s per player. The 100% horn won't degrade below 10m. You get ra/ex drops, a handful of elixirs from the NMs themselves, and you're doing new and exciting content that requires an attentive alliance instead of beating up on a harmless NM from over a year ago. Two runs with a 1h reset in between is going to be as profitable as ADL, with a fixed achievable goal(I really doubt that most groups can farm 6 marrows consistantly with that few.. and there's a bit of luck overhead, you'll inevitably get runs where pen wants to screw you).

I'm not disagreeing with the greater problems, but to pretend ADL is more profitable than delve is a bit shortsighted, and I suspect you're only doing so because you don't have access to a group large enough to farm delve.

70 k plasm is basically 7M per character per run. There are 18 players splitting the airlixir +2 and the horn that dropped so it doesn't greatly enhance the reward on a per character basis. So if you go purely for money, you do like 8M in a successful run of 45 minutes. Sure it's about comparable theoritically to marrows in a 6 man group. There are several issues though

- 18 man event with an experienced LS. In FFXI, no LS has ever been able to successfully gather 18+ ppl for several days or weeks. You can act as if it's as easy as triboxing ADLs, it's not.
- Farming plasm for money seems a bit retarded. Use money to buy relics ...?
- I'm just saying that if you got say 2 delve gear to max at rank 15, there are several option for you : farm plasm for a retarded progression rate on airlixirs ; farm NMs like the matamata for a mediocre progression rate ( 42 airlixirs 20% of which are HQ in one hour to split between 3 players) ; spent 2 hours in dynamis and fully upgrade 2 pieces of delve gear with 6 marrows used to buy some airlixirs +2 ; spam delve with 18 man ally nowhere available plus you need one that clears bosses. The last possibilitie is not even faster that the marrow one and very unlikely. I mean it's clear to anyone that anyone doing boss atm is capped on delve gear.


Anyway the marrow part of the post is anectotical. The point is seekers didn't make player move to the extension. Here is a copy/pasta of the shouts happening on quetz

Hershel : 新サルゼオルムいきます！無属性○前衛,詩(サポシ),赤or白or学募集！サチコ参照テルください！ 1/3~
(salvage)
LowJeuno
Mikky : Fafnir1戦or2戦 傭兵募集です。サチコメ参照の上 TELLください〜
(KSNM99)
UpJeuno
Hershel : 新サルゼオルムいきます！無属性○前衛,詩(サポシ),赤or白or学募集！サチコ参照テルください！ 1/3~
(salvage)
PortJeuno
Deweycox : «O. Bronzepiece» «T. Whiteshell» 5k «Can I have it?» «/tell»88888
(dynamis)
LowJeuno
Louc : «Salvage»突入お手伝いさん１名募集 20万ギルでどなたかお願いしますー
(salvage)
LowJeuno
Kutajimatoshito : アビセアアルテパにドミニオン乱獲しに行きませんか〜参加者いろいろ募集〜現在11名。箱〆
(abyssea exp)
LowJeuno
Fire : ケイザック武器解放４いきませんか？ ナイト、コルセア、詩人募集中 詳細はサチコメで 現在４名
(delve farm NMs)
LowJeuno
Louc : «Salvage»突入お手伝いさん１名募集 20万ギルでどなたかお願いしますー
(salvage)
UpJeuno
Kutajimatoshito : アビセアアルテパにドミニオン乱獲しに行きませんか〜参加者いろいろ募集〜現在13名。箱〆
(abyssea exp)
PortJeuno
Culoren : Aアルテパ上下ケルベロス１戦ずつ 型紙 アートマ ラーニング希望の方はTell下さい。
(abyssea)
UpJeuno
Hershel : 新サルゼオルムいきます！無属性○前衛,詩(サポシ),赤or白or学募集！サチコ参照テルください！ 1/3~
(salvage)
LowJeuno
Hershel : 中止します！エール失礼しました！
UpJeuno
Kutajimatoshito : アビセアアルテパにドミニオン乱獲しに行きませんか〜参加者いろいろ募集〜現在13名。箱〆
(abyssea)
PortJeuno
Culoren : Aアルテパ上下ケルベロス１戦ずつ 型紙 アートマ ラーニング希望の方はTell下さい。
(abyssea)
LowJeuno
Kutajimatoshito : アビセアアルテパにドミニオン乱獲しに行きませんか〜参加者いろいろ募集〜＠2名ですー。箱〆
(abyssea)
UpJeuno
Soracha : 20万ギルでサル突入を手伝ってくださる方を2名募集します、やってくださる方いらっしゃいましたらテルくださいな〜
(salvage)
PortJeuno
Culoren : Aアルテパ上下ケルベロス１戦ずつ 型紙 アートマ ラーニング希望の方はTell下さい。
(aby exp)
LowJeuno
Louc : 〆ますー ありがとうございました！
LowJeuno
Kuya : looking for black Chococard M and F «Can I have it?»
PortJeuno
Culoren : Aアルテパ上下ケルベロス１戦ずつ 型紙 アートマ ラーニング希望の方はTell下さい。現在５名
LowJeuno
Alphe : 革93↑練成74位の職人さん、10万Gで練成をお願いできませんでしょうか？(当方練成スキル○)
PortJeuno
Soracha : 20万ギルでサル突入を手伝ってくださる方を2名募集します、やってくださる方いらっしゃいましたらテルくださいな〜
PortJeuno
Culoren : Aアルテパ上下ケルベロス１戦ずつ 型紙 アートマ ラーニング希望の方はTell下さい。現在6名
LowJeuno
Uichiy : 21時からメナモリNMボス サチコ確認後テルください
LowJeuno
Soracha : 20万ギルでサル突入を手伝ってくださる方を2名募集します、やってくださる方いらっしゃいましたらテルくださいな〜

All I see is abyssea exp and salvage with one shout for delve NMs .. It's pretty pathetic considering jps are the most involved into delve...

[Demon6324236]

Right now I'm just holding out to see if the developers flip a switch like Microsoft did and the game direction changes to something I can enjoy again.

I doubt it.

Key difference between Microsoft's changes and what SE could do. Microsoft was looking at their upcoming product failing because of bad business choices, and saw that if they did not do something then the console itself would flop, and a lot of investment as well as possibly an entire generation of consoles would be lost. SE on the other hand is looking at their old, and soon to be replaced MMO, if it flops, their new one has all their support, if it stays alive, it makes more money for sure, but still, its their old game, not as much riding on it as a new game, or console. I do agree though, I hope they turn around with some of these concepts and make things better, I have mixed feeling about everything that has happened in a while, most of all Delve, while I think Delve as an event is great, it brought terrible things with it.

[Svens]

Really wished Skirmish wasn't such a giant facepalm as described. As if the initially scarce pop items wasn't bad enough, now they're saying that the augments we currently have on our weapons will need to be erased before they can be upgraded, which is a dangerous precedent to set. If they're okay with that, imagine if they try to do the same with delve equipment. "Hey guys, we made +1 versions of all your weapons and armors! You'll have to erase any augments on them before upgrading, making all the time you spent on them wasted!"

[Sarick]

They should've just stuck with merit upgrades and added quest MN fights that increased the capacity of slots. This gear = levels sucks something horrible. It is just adding more content trash to fll the players storage. If it was based around merits people could do quest or nms to unlock +1-5 in say stats or +1-5 in weapon skills category. All while randomly dropping items and points that allow players to purchase items they want to upgrade RMES and DELVE weapons.

Merits have infinite growth possibilities! A single piece of gear also has infinite growth possibilities but once unequipped or replaced everything you put into it is lost. This is an issue that discourages players if items you earn become obsoleted. Marits growth options would never be obsolete. Sure you could change things around but you'd always keep the upgraded merit capacity. When the game adds new enemies growth will always be available and players would feel like they lost content working on it.

To assist players into helping others below the elite status triple+ enhanced rewards should be given if a group contains players who haven't beaten a NM and unlocked its benefits in their merits. Elitist mostly care only about themselves. If they have a truly gifted group setup then they should be able to handle one or two weak links. As a matter a fact be rewarded greatly for doing it. After all dragging around a weak link does increase the difficulty.

They get their points to upgrade their precious high end gear and are rewarded for helping others unlock merits!

Currently the game is setup to shun players who aren't up to specific standards. Adding a system that recognizes when a player helps another increasing their difficulty rewards them. This is a step in making the game BETTER for everyone. The developers would need to do to keep people from abusing this by restricting level and nation ranks to ensure players don't simply level up a mule.

I hate the new system also because it is a dog eat dog backstabbing system that requires to much social ass kissing or RMT style mercing to participate in anything unless you're already at the top. How fun is that? well, it's not fun.


You want to extend game play do it in a way that EVERYONE has a place in it. This new item system is chit and it separates the player base significantly to the point where you simply can't participate in content unless you're hard core in the first place. The developer need a serious translated WAKE UP call. I can assure you 100% of what people like myself have been saying hasn't been being translated to the developer. It's a fact THEY DON'T CARE if they ruin this game.

[Vivivivi]

With regards to the casual player base, I think it's important to keep in mind Seeker's is not complete. Skirmish was made too obscure to participate in, and already steps have been taken to make it more accessible, and it looks like it has a future. Yes while it's true that currently delve weapons blow the Skirmish weapons out of the water, remember the base stats for many of the Skirmish weapons are on par or better than the base damage from a level 75 Relic, Mythic or level 85 Empyrean, something that was previously unobtainable for the casual player (with exception of a few rare high priced crafted items).

Again, I have a handful of friends who are self described casual players who see Delve as hardcore stuff, but those people regularly participate in skirmish, reives, and meebles, and for the most part are big fans of that content. Their voices are also largely not represented on these forums because well, they're casual players. The don't play every day, but they play maybe every other day for a couple hours here and there, and for that audience, I think Skirmish, reives, and Meebles are fantastic ways for them to stay current and not be entirely excluded from everything.

What I DO agree with that many people are expressing on here is that the low-man content for non-casual players has been missing in Seeker's so far. I was having a blast for months with my small six to eight person linkshell that worked together on empyrean weapons, and salvage, but there is little for our group to do with those numbers in Adoulin, and Seeker's has effectively disbanded our shell because our group dispersed into larger Delve-centric shells.

I come back to my original stance on Seeker's- I think it's a work in progress, and the only way it will improve, is by us continuing to offer our constructive criticism, because ever since Mr. Matsui took charge, I feel the team is listening to us more now than ever.

[Powder]

Uh you can't get Plasm by farming dynamis. All the Airlixirs +2 do is upgrade equipment and weapons, they don't buy you the weapons or equipment. The best way to get the plasm is killing mega boss and NMs in fracture. The expansion was promising at first but it has upset me a little as well. After I saw that R/E/M were trashed, I knew they would change it due to popular opinion but its taking a while. A lot of people are so against delve and they know most of the crap we're getting now will become obsolete. They introduced a new system to a game that was set in its ways with how things worked in terms of gear progression. I just think it will take a little while for things to get better.

I think they also alienated the casual player base of the game too much. The delve Mega boss aren't easy to PUG on most servers due to low population or inexperience etc. There isn't much to low-man in the new expansion and a lot of people who don't have access to a big LS are bored out of their minds (which is understandable.) I think they should work on that before they continue to keep obsoleting gear that came out a month ago.

<3 You spoke my heart with this post. I am so disappointed I don't even want to play. I wouldn't buy a car I can't drive but I have bought an expansion I can't do much in. I am not into jumping in big alliances with strangers and being checked. I have friends that has happened to and the leader kicked them for their gear. When I heard that I didn't even bother trying to do anything but reives and that is getting old like a dog chasing it's tail and getting no where.

[Kojo]

Why don't we just have SE close down SoA content and give it a reboot like FFXIV? Or they could just remove SoA and everything that came with it and let the game be fun again. I came for RUN and after 99 levels got pretty much nothing, my PUP can tank better than RUN. I gained pretty much nothing with this expansion which is one reason I haven't logged on in close to 3 weeks, and was only checking in here and there before that.

[Demon6324236]

You want to extend game play do it in a way that EVERYONE has a place in it. This new item system is chit and it separates the player base significantly to the point where you simply can't participate in content unless you're hard core in the first place.

Just a question, how much of this playerbase do you think is hardcore? If you can not do content unless your hardcore, what are casual players doing? Is there a reason casual players are doing nothing? I mean there is other content in the game, Delve is not everything there is, yet everyone seems hellbent on believing it is.

I fail to see how item level will be any different than now. What, you seriously think people will shout for people in gear that puts them to 110+? That would be retarded, even more so than RMED requirements, at least with RMEDs you are assured they are using a good weapon, for all I know if I shout for a level 110+ person they might show up in literally some of the worst gear in the game that puts them at that level. I don't mean bad as in not the best, literally stupid gear, like the Mikinaak hands, no augments, with just VIT+7 INT+13 MND+13 Attack+13 Haste+4%.

I think that item levels are a waste of time, especially if it effects nothing outside of Adoulin when it comes to xp, because that means the entirety of that change is meaningless... Really what you are saying makes no sense to me right here. Like I said, if hardcores are the only one who can do Delve, then why are casual players not following the tree SE gave? Yes, your excluded from Delve, but there is other content, Skirmish is just waiting for people to do it, since the items there are needed for Skirmish II weapons, who knows, might be able to get some interest sparked into it!