Item Levels

[Demon6324236]

I still don't like this system, especially if its only effecting a single hand... if you want to make it as though we leveled up, make it effect both hands, after all, my normal skill effects both hands, why the hell should my offhand always be forcibly gimp!? I am tired of having to make 1handed DDs suck, fixing STR/DEX ratio was 1 thing, I can accept not getting the extra Attack on my offhand, but this... this is stupid, and its just another way to hurt these jobs. No matter what happens, no matter what weapons get these stats, 1 of my weapons having roughly 190 more Attack and Accuracy on it severely gimps my other weapon by comparison. Stop fucking over 1 handed DDs so much, we already have flaws on these jobs, like having 2 different weapons, meaning 1 is always a lower DMG than the other, or how about how Dual Wield lowers our TP gain per hit? Just make it effect both, like it has the last decade, so its just like if we leveled, rather than screwing over the 1handed DDs once again.

[Delvish]

I still don't like this system, especially if its only effecting a single hand... if you want to make it as though we leveled up, make it effect both hands, after all, my normal skill effects both hands, why the hell should my offhand always be forcibly gimp!? I am tired of having to make 1handed DDs suck, fixing STR/DEX ratio was 1 thing, I can accept not getting the extra Attack on my offhand, but this... this is stupid, and its just another way to hurt these jobs. No matter what happens, no matter what weapons get these stats, 1 of my weapons having roughly 190 more Attack and Accuracy on it severely gimps my other weapon by comparison. Stop fucking over 1 handed DDs so much, we already have flaws on these jobs, like having 2 different weapons, meaning 1 is always a lower DMG than the other, or how about how Dual Wield lowers our TP gain per hit? Just make it effect both, like it has the last decade, so its just like if we leveled, rather than screwing over the 1handed DDs once again.

Your offhand isn't being forcibly gimp. There just aren't weapons available for your off-hand this month for an equivalent amount of skill. Say you were main-handing a lvl 120 Mandau with +188 skill, but off-hand Triplus for triple attack. You took a level 89 dagger to a level 120 fight. That is like taking a level 60 dagger to a level 99 fight. Even if your offhand is a standard 99 dagger, that is still equivalent to a level 69 dagger to a 99 fight. You just don't do it, unless you're trying to get TH+ (but that is a sore subject).

[Xerius]

That is like taking a level 60 dagger to a level 99 fight. Even if your offhand is a standard 99 dagger, that is still equivalent to a level 69 dagger to a 99 fight.

True but since you'd have your native skills capped on that job (most likely) even with a level 69 dagger you're not going to take that huge hit in accuracy a level 69 dagger and a level 99 dagger would have the same amount of accuracy and attack the only difference would be the damage rating on the 2 weapon.

[Kincard]

Do any of you have confidence in SE that they'll add 2 weapons of each ilevel in a timely manner when they don't even have 1 months after launch?

Just make it so that the skill+ is a "main-hand:" stat and have it apply to both hands. Problem solved. Doing it this way just makes it unnecessarily more difficult for one-handers which already have a hard time ever keeping up.

[Delvish]

They've already added a metric ton of new weapons. Bayld weapons, Wildskeeper rieves, Skirmish, Delve, etc. There is a decently large selection and each of them will get an associated skill+. You don't need two weapons for each level. Use a Skirmish and a Bayld. Skirmish and WK. Delve and WK. Eventually it'll be RME and Delve as the highest tier.

Edit: Even more weapons to come in the next update.

[Demon6324236]

Your offhand isn't being forcibly gimp. There just aren't weapons available for your off-hand this month for an equivalent amount of skill. Say you were main-handing a lvl 120 Mandau with +188 skill, but off-hand Triplus for triple attack. You took a level 89 dagger to a level 120 fight. That is like taking a level 60 dagger to a level 99 fight. Even if your offhand is a standard 99 dagger, that is still equivalent to a level 69 dagger to a 99 fight. You just don't do it, unless you're trying to get TH+ (but that is a sore subject).

Here is the problem with that, they almost always seem to make a series of weapons these days, 1 for each class of weapon, and that is all. For instance, Delve bosses drop weapons, each of the weapons crafted by the items they drop seem to be in line with their stats we as well, putting them in the same class, the weapons from T4~5 are the same way, as are Coalition weapons. Going by this design, we will have 1 dagger, sword, katana, and so on, which is 188 skill, the rest will not have that much, which means my skill in my other hand is lower.

Now here is where the problem gets worse, we basically just advanced 20 levels, how many weapons are there within these 20 levels? For each class of weapon we basically have 1 weapon. So for instance, my RDM, lets see how many weapons at 100+ I have for CQB... 1 from Coalitions, the crafted Bihkah/+1 sword, 1 from Reives, 1 from Skirmish, soon another from Skirmish, 1 from T4~5 Delve, and 1 from Delve Bosses. So 6~7 weapons for RDM in 20 levels of growth, even if you add proper skill to each of them, there are no 2 weapons at the same level in a class of weapons so far as I know. Since 2handed jobs get the full effects from their skill level, as it only takes your main hand, WAR, SAM, DRK, and so on are all at full power, while 1handed jobs are screwed with or without a single weapon with these skill levels, as 1 of our hands will always be far weaker than the other. That is the real issue, and now they are just shitting on 1handed jobs again by making our offhand even worse...

[FrankReynolds]

Here is the problem with that, they almost always seem to make a series of weapons these days, 1 for each class of weapon, and that is all. For instance, Delve bosses drop weapons, each of the weapons crafted by the items they drop seem to be in line with their stats we as well, putting them in the same class, the weapons from T4~5 are the same way, as are Coalition weapons. Going by this design, we will have 1 dagger, sword, katana, and so on, which is 188 skill, the rest will not have that much, which means my skill in my other hand is lower.

Now here is where the problem gets worse, we basically just advanced 20 levels, how many weapons are there within these 20 levels? For each class of weapon we basically have 1 weapon. So for instance, my RDM, lets see how many weapons at 100+ I have for CQB... 1 from Coalitions, the crafted Bihkah/+1 sword, 1 from Reives, 1 from Skirmish, soon another from Skirmish, 1 from T4~5 Delve, and 1 from Delve Bosses. So 6~7 weapons for RDM in 20 levels of growth, even if you add proper skill to each of them, there are no 2 weapons at the same level in a class of weapons so far as I know. Since 2handed jobs get the full effects from their skill level, as it only takes your main hand, WAR, SAM, DRK, and so on are all at full power, while 1handed jobs are screwed with or without a single weapon with these skill levels, as 1 of our hands will always be far weaker than the other. That is the real issue, and now they are just shitting on 1handed jobs again by making our offhand even worse...

Not only that, but you will have to obtain twice as many weapons in order to still do shittier damage than a one handed job.

[Delvish]

To me, it seems like your issue is with the large quantity of R/EX gear and less with this skill adjustment. They aren't lowering anything or making things worse. Now you can hit stuff better and hit stuff harder. This issue with dual-wielders not wielding the same thing in both hands has been around for as long as Dual-wield has been around.

[FrankReynolds]

To me, it seems like your issue is with the large quantity of R/EX gear and less with this skill adjustment. They aren't lowering anything or making things worse. Now you can hit stuff better and hit stuff harder. This issue with dual-wielders not wielding the same thing in both hands has been around for as long as Dual-wield has been around.

Do you have any idea what the hit rate and attack differences are on a weapon with 188 skill versus a weapon with 67 skill? They shouldn't even be in the same game together.

EDIT: Besides, since when does 10 years of bad design warrant ten more? And Why is is okay for them to release everything a 2 hander needs in the weapon slot, but only half of what dual wielders need?

Would you have been okay with it if they had said "Oh hai guyz! In this update we will be raising the level cap from 99 to 120... for everyone except for these 6 jobs. If you are a ninja, thief, red mage, blue mage, dancer, BST or really just anyone who uses two weapons, you will remain 20 levels lower than everyone else for the next couple months, or maybe forever. Who knows..."

Because that's basically what they said.

[Demon6324236]

To me, it seems like your issue is with the large quantity of R/EX gear and less with this skill adjustment. They aren't lowering anything or making things worse. Now you can hit stuff better and hit stuff harder. This issue with dual-wielders not wielding the same thing in both hands has been around for as long as Dual-wield has been around.

The thing is, the gap between hands is getting bigger, not smaller, which also creates a larger gap between 1handed and 2handed, which in the end results in 1handers being even further behind. The larger the gap gets between a 1handed job's weapons, the worse the job will be, and this change is only making that issue worse.