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Thread: More Magic

  1. #11
    Player Sofrid's Avatar
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    Sofrid
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    Bahamut
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    WHM Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Bamph View Post
    All the spells are on the high side (minus sacrifice II, but that would have the inherent cost of losing the MP you had when you get weakened ~800 probably). This would be done for balance so that the WHM would have the option of unweaknessing people or keeping others cured (preventing them from willy-nilly Arise II-ing one person while the party still needs healing). I thought I was being on the conservative side of things with my MP cost.
    You could always give WHM the Reviviscence TP move, tied to a weapon or something that's demanding. (It's the one that Ferreous Coffin uses in Campaign Battle that unweakens a player.) That, or make Arise II tied to a JA and Penury not applicable. (Remember Penury cuts the casting MP of white magic by 50%.)


    I never thought that you could use sacrifice in such a manner... if you were poisoned, and sacrificed to pull the poison away from someone else, I figured it would fail because you were already poisoned. (I looked it up on wiki now that you said it... you can :S. WTF... that's not much of a sacrifice then). If the WHM was weakened and tried to pull away another person's weakness, I'd be all for that WHM dying (and removing reraise). In fact, I'd be OK with it being guaranteed to pull away weakness, but have a chance of dying right afterwards.
    WHM dying and removing Reraise is so detrimental that I would think really hard before using it, especially when the penalty to WHM would be far higher. There's a reason why Reraise (I/II/III) had their level obtained from 33/60/75 lowered to the same level as Raise (I/II/III).

    I didn't think that removing doom had anything to do with skill level, just luck. I've used cursna on whm with little skill (I know... BAD WHM!), and my wife used it on hers with capped skill, and we both had about the same success rate. And I always thought that cursna just removed curse if you were cursed, no questions asked, unless it was a different curse (like the difference between silence and mute). (I misread you... I thought you said cursna OR doom, however, I struck it out because I like it as a stepping point for this next spell idea). On a similar note, we need a doomna, or a "insert -na spell here" II that removes the higher tiers. Maybe an Erase II that can erase doom or amnesia.
    I think Doom shouldn't be included, as Doom already covered under Cursna. I don't know about amnesia, however.
    (0)

  2. #12
    Player FaeQueenCory's Avatar
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    Jun 2013
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    Character
    Eliosha
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Sofrid View Post
    I would be in favor of a status ailment that only takes away the JAs (and not WS). You will still get your damage in, and it's not as debilitating to most players (excluding, say, SMN, DNC, COR, SAM and RUN).

    Or even a specific fight that gives you all your JA but not WS. (Again, debilitating for SAM and probably DNC thought not as much for DNC).

    The new gear heightening damage means that the HP value of mobs must increase exponentially as well. It's unfortunate, but it must be done.
    LoL Nonono, I mean that you don't make a boss HARDER by giving them more HP. That doesn't make them actually more difficult, it just makes them take longer to kill. (the weapons deal more dmg now, so bosses need more hp is actually the reverse of the actual process: bosses got more HP, implemented new weapons to make re-fighting them faster.)

    And it's not so much the crippling that I am lamenting... it's the lack of whm's ability to... whm it.
    If there was an amnesina, I wouldn't care about having NMs drop that on ppl.
    Just like how no one cares when they get petrified, or super-paralyzed, or silenced or what have you.
    Because, save for when these effects are auras, a whm can remove these ailments.
    They can't do so with amnesia.
    The most you can hope for with that is a lower duration cause of baramnesira. And that's just awful.

    WHM can get rid of doom. DOOM. (I know it's only a chance and only really "reliable" with "enhance cursna" gear.... I don't even think we know for certain if that gear stacks.....) But WHM can't get rid of amnesia? That's just dumb.

    Making multiple types of amnesias, like you suggest, could be great and be handled much like the different types of plague and curses are handled....
    But WHM really should have the -na for them. Even if it's as unreliable as a cursna for doom.... that's 100000000000000000x better than relying on bar-status spells. (or if they made the bar-ailments add an actual resist chance instead of just lessening the duration... I might think more highly of them.)

    EDIT:
    Quote Originally Posted by Sofrid View Post
    I think Doom shouldn't be included, as Doom already covered under Cursna. I don't know about amnesia, however.
    As I pointed out (before seeing this LoL) WHM can already deal with all current ailments.... except amnesia.
    It's the ONLY ailment whm just can not cure.
    And considering that is the ONLY job of a whm in a party.... that's really messed up.
    (1)
    Last edited by FaeQueenCory; 08-19-2013 at 11:05 PM.

  3. #13
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    WHM could use a spell to remove weakness. No, not 'I died and raised up' weakness, I mean this bullshit status ailment weakness which half of the new breed NMs that have come out since Jeuno II VW have had. Weakness caused by a special attack from an enemy should be possible to remove. I would say the opposite of death weakness, that should not be possible to remove. One is a clear penalty for having died, the other is a cheap tactic used by the Devs to create a more challenging enemy by making it use one of the most penalizing ailments in any FF game as an Area of Effect type move.
    (1)

  4. #14
    Player FaeQueenCory's Avatar
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    Character
    Eliosha
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Demon6324236 View Post
    WHM could use a spell to remove weakness. No, not 'I died and raised up' weakness, I mean this bullshit status ailment weakness which half of the new breed NMs that have come out since Jeuno II VW have had. Weakness caused by a special attack from an enemy should be possible to remove. I would say the opposite of death weakness, that should not be possible to remove. One is a clear penalty for having died, the other is a cheap tactic used by the Devs to create a more challenging enemy by making it use one of the most penalizing ailments in any FF game as an Area of Effect type move.
    This would be more than acceptable..... if said form of weakness is an actual different ailment.
    ...
    Which I don't think it is.
    It'd be much better to just not do this sort of BS and actually develop real challenges... instead of artificial ones like BAM-weakend and amnesia auras.
    (0)

  5. #15
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    I believe they used Weakness because its heavy penalty on HP/MP while it also gives 100% Slow, so an enemy can use it and then stack its normal debuffs on top of those, allowing for a ton of Slow and a ton of HP/MP Down. I cant say for sure that it is another ailment, its probably the exact same, but I would hope they could allow it to work with different rules depending on how its causes, kinda like Reraise. Some forms of Reraise wear off due to certain events like entering a Battlefield, while others do not, I assume they are both the same thing, but their causes change their abilities to be removed & such. If the same kind of thing could be done with Weakness, it should be able to be removed with a spell, but if not, then SE simply needs to be smarter with their implementation of ailments.
    (0)

  6. #16
    Player Sofrid's Avatar
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    Sofrid
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    WHM Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Demon6324236 View Post
    I believe they used Weakness because its heavy penalty on HP/MP while it also gives 100% Slow, so an enemy can use it and then stack its normal debuffs on top of those, allowing for a ton of Slow and a ton of HP/MP Down. I cant say for sure that it is another ailment, its probably the exact same, but I would hope they could allow it to work with different rules depending on how its causes, kinda like Reraise. Some forms of Reraise wear off due to certain events like entering a Battlefield, while others do not, I assume they are both the same thing, but their causes change their abilities to be removed & such. If the same kind of thing could be done with Weakness, it should be able to be removed with a spell, but if not, then SE simply needs to be smarter with their implementation of ailments.
    Just like how curse has a movement speed down that stacks with gravity? (On top of the MaxHP/MaxMP reduction).
    (0)

  7. #17
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    In a way yes. Curse is Max HP down fused with Gravity the same way Weakness is Max HP down, Max MP down, and Slow all fused together. I assume in many cases they made it this way so that they could stack multiple ailments against us. For instance, if a NM can inflict Weakness, Curse, and Max HP Down on a player, that player's HP would drop very, very low. However, if each of the 3 attacks that cause those were only to inflict Max HP Down, either 1 would have to be much stronger than the others, or they would not allow them to stack and thus the player would be unaffected by the additional ones. The thing about weakness is that unlike Curse, weakness has no way to remove it, and unless they add a way to remove weakness caused by mobs, it will continue to be nothing more than another cheap attack tactic they give NMs, just like stripping off all of our gear, short count AoE doom abilities, and so on. Things like that are nothing more than annoyances in this game and they give us no real way to combat it besides dying, raising, and throwing ourselves at it again, or using moves that make us invincible in some way.
    (2)

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