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  1. #21
    Player Luvbunny's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    1,395
    Character
    Luvbunny
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    I don't know what you do in SoA that is addictive. Whacking roots with extremely bad lag is not my idea of fun to be honest. Going to another area to do different reive where no one is around and your shout for location is ignored for 20-30 mnts is also not fun. Getting measly bayld is also not fun, yes they up the amount you can receive but for some reasons I can't get more than 1k coming as RDM which is a job that do A LOT of things.... They seriously need to revise -again - on how mages can get bayld in reives. Not to mention in the crowded areas, reives are done in 5-8 mnts max which translate to pitiful bayld.
    (3)

  2. #22
    Player Yinnyth's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    839
    Character
    Yinnyth
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    BRD Lv 99
    Following the cycle in Yahse or Morimar often turns out quite lucrative for me, though there are times of day that simply won't work for it unless I grab some interested people and form a group myself. Since the update, I've had reives that give my dualboxed rune 5k bayld and my bard 4k bayld.

    The key to successful reives is balancing the damage you do to the roots/rocks/hive with the actions you take on enemies. If everyone is slaughtering mobs and one beastmaster pet is the only thing hitting the roots, no one will get much bayld per evaluation. If everyone is slaughtering the roots and just sleeping or supertanking the mobs, you don't get many evaluations and not much time to rack up points anyways, so again, not much bayld. If you're duoing, sure, one guy keeps the mobs busy while the other kills roots. If you have 4 people, 2 on roots, 2 on mobs. When you start to get up to 8-12 people and above, you want slightly more people on mobs than roots. When it's over 12 people, you want groups on both sides of the roots so you have access to all the mobs. And always go for the reive unity scores. I also recommend popping your SP at the start of the reive if it's a long duration one like soul voice or tabula rasa, and don't be afraid to use it mid-way through the fight if it's shorter duration.

    If reives groups suck or I'm tired of them, I go mining in Morimar. Haven't really figured out how that fatigue or critical quarry mess work out yet, but I've made a little bit of gil off ore. Also did the mummer's guild minigames to get myself some spectacles incase I find a statue in a pyre. Hoping I can make some even better gil off those if I start finding them. Aside from that, there's my completion footwork I've been slowly chipping away at. Build fame in Adoulin, get all my waypoints, etc.
    (5)

  3. #23
    Player Luvbunny's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    1,395
    Character
    Luvbunny
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Still does not solve the lag problem though. It is horrible when you have a lot of people, and because the area is so small, it's even worse than Walk of Echoes. You went to try to attack or nuke, and the mob is dead. And yes I alternate between attacking mob and roots. This weekend was really bad in terms of rewards, getting a measly 1k and even ZERO....if that is possible, and I was doing everything from healing, attacking, buffing, etc. And yes I have the key items logging and reive unity.

    The problem with Reive is that you cannot control the players, it's whackaton everyone do what they want type of thing. Even if you manage to make an alliance, you can't control the random single or duo that join. When you have 18 people in that crowded area, the lag is very very bad. Hence a lot of people just come melee since auto attack and WS is easier than trying to do everything. With Reive Unity KI - you almost don't need healer, which kills any chance of WHM getting bayld from curing. In crowded areas, not even worth doing it, but if you go to Moh or Sih gates, there are like 6 random people, so you can't really do it on your own either.
    (2)
    Last edited by Luvbunny; 04-22-2013 at 02:19 AM.

  4. #24
    Player Nephilipitou's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Posts
    60
    Character
    Nephilipitou
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    SCH Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Luvbunny View Post
    Still does not solve the lag problem though.

    The problem with Reive is that you cannot control the players, it's whackaton everyone do what they want type of thing. Even if you manage to make an alliance, you can't control the random single or duo that join. When you have 18 people in that crowded area, the lag is very very bad.
    Fact of the matter is there are so many ways to fix your issue.

    1. Keep up with your IMPs as these can be almost like what? 6-8k bayld a day for showing up to a reive, letting people beat it, turning it in, and then going back out.

    2. You can store imps for later and then just do them rapid fire one day.

    3. You can find a static for Reives and earn your Naakual bayld by doing the easier reives with your static. You're going to need team work for this stuff anyway right?

    4. You can do non combat related tasks.

    5. You can do peacekeeper's Reives with fewer people

    6. You can just go do content to make you lots of gil, and then buy items off the AH, and then convert those items into Bayld using the IMP system.

    7. You can go to less crowded areas and do shouts in Jueno to get people interested in earning bayld the right way

    8. You can coordinate with your LS.

    There's lots of solutions to your issue. The problem is I don't think you care about compromise.
    (7)
    Last edited by Nephilipitou; 04-22-2013 at 05:23 AM.

  5. #25
    Player Luvbunny's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,395
    Character
    Luvbunny
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Yes, I have been doing the delivery one so far, since it is less "lag" and non combat related. And yeah I stored the tags by signing up for ones I never intended to do and retrieve them later so I can spam 30 tags at once. It still does not solve the lag issue on the reives, the fact that mages still not earning enough bayld, and the fact that you have to do so many of these to rank up on each individual coalition. It's a decent start, maybe in 4-6 months it will be more bearable, assuming more people are doing it and they must love whacking roots since that is all there is to do for peacekeepers, in every single zone... I rather do a kill 5 mobs type of activities and get rewarded.
    (2)

  6. #26
    Player Yinnyth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    839
    Character
    Yinnyth
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    BRD Lv 99
    Roots, rocks, and nests are what you do for bayld so you can get access to other things. Just like how you don't actually want to kill Baba Yaga repeatedly, you just want to pop Carabosse so you can get gems from her over and over again until you have enough to upgrade your empy to the next level.

    People are still beating up pixies so they can pop Baba Yaga, so I can only assume people will still be beating up roots 3 years from now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Luvbunny View Post
    Yes, I have been doing the delivery one so far, since it is less "lag" and non combat related. And yeah I stored the tags by signing up for ones I never intended to do and retrieve them later so I can spam 30 tags at once.
    Quote Originally Posted by Luvbunny View Post
    No point of playing as "paying beta tester" - I ain't going to suck it up and deal with it, it's best to avoid the content till more adjustment is being made.
    I'm glad you've changed your mind and decided to play with us. That's not even sarcasm, it's honesty. It shows you're dedicated to the game even if it turns a direction you're not currently happy with.
    (0)
    Last edited by Yinnyth; 04-22-2013 at 05:50 PM.

  7. #27
    Player Sarick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    732
    Character
    Saricks
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    RDM Lv 99
    I only see the SAME hardcore players condescending Luvbunny about her negative dislikes yet, I rarely see anyone talking about how wonderful this game is publicly. The opinions of zealous players that like the changes seem entirely one sided. No amount of mistakes will ever result in failure.

    Did it ever occur to you that some people just don't like the new design? I've also played FFXI since the PS2 launch I'm not playing ATM. I hear garbage about the SoA expansion not being installed on other parts of the game world but the development changes from it affect hate and core combat in nearly every aspect. Also, the new systems are just rehashes of old systems created as time syncs with minimal rewards.

    Fact is not everyone is openly complaining every day. Why? because its of no consequence or resolve. Players that openly defend the development team are merely obsessive tools that represent no one but themselves. The development can make no wrongs in their eyes even if the subscriber base is rapidly dieing in the background.

    Right now things are still new, the fresh lure binds a few less active players to the world for a short time. Unfortunately, this won't last long mark my words and these temporary gains will vanish. Walk of echos was once popular now it's not so much. This game reminiscent of how drugs effect addicts. Each time they take a hit they need more drugs to feel better. When the drug wears off the lows become worse. In this respect the expansion was an injection that brought back a few players but it'll make people want more then previous expansions to stay.

    I'm in full support of what LuvBunny has been saying and no amount of arse kissing from condescending tools is going to change those opinions. I believe the developments direction is headed the wrong way and we'll soon see results that shed light on reality over blind support. What I see is the blind leading the blind not the other way around.

    Don't feel like typing anymore so ta ta..
    (6)
    Last edited by Sarick; 04-22-2013 at 10:03 PM.
    Developers take notice when a post has a lot of likes. Please support your fellow posters if they make good suggestions or comments by clicking the like.

  8. #28
    Player Horadrim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Windurst
    Posts
    411
    Character
    Horadrim
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    COR Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Yinnyth View Post
    You can have a very large reward/risk ratio without making the game as easy as abyssea. Modern NNI is a good example of this. The risk is tiny. 1 failure is only 30 minutes lost. The reward is massive. Everyone in the group gets 1 piece of their choice, plus a pouch of alexandrite and random armor drops.

    The difficulty of this event is higher than most other events however. While it's true that a really good group can get unlucky, or a really bad group can get lucky, both try again 30 minutes later and over a series of runs, skillful play is gradually rewarded.
    Doesn't stop people from being assholes about it, though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarick View Post
    I only see the SAME hardcore players condescending Luvbunny about her negative dislikes yet, I rarely see anyone talking about how wonderful this game is publicly. The opinions of zealous players that like the changes seem entirely one sided. No amount of mistakes will ever result in failure.
    Go to the WoW forums, the League of Legends forums, SWTOR, GW2, or any other forum.

    Find me consistent posts of people praising the game and talking about how much they enjoy it. I'll wait.

    This argument does nothing but show you don't really understand how gaming communities work -- no one, even for offline games, comes to the forums to talk about how amazing and awesome the game is. Even on say, the Pokemon forums on Gamefaqs you rarely see someone pop in just to say "omfg, I love how they improved this!"

    People who like things tend to invest their time into enjoying them. Forums, for the most part, harbor people who are either unhappy for one reason or another or who want to be privy to new information as it arises within the community. Does that mean that the prevalence of negativity is indicative of a bad product? No.

    There's such thing as the vocal minority -- No matter how you spin it, forum goers represent a relatively small portion of the game's community, even within FFXI's diminished numbers. I did a tallying of the number of active members on Killing Ifrit way back during FFXI's prime and the numbers added up to significantly less than 10% of the community. I have my extreme doubts that the number of people here (considering after only 2-3 months back I can recognize most people posting by their sentence structure with how common we all are across the forum pages) breaks even that percentage of the game's active community.

    EDIT:

    And of course some people don't like the new design. You can't please everyone one -- and if they tried to, we'd be worse off.

    Fact is not everyone is openly complaining every day. Why? because its of no consequence or resolve. Players that openly defend the development team are merely obsessive tools that represent no one but themselves. The development can make no wrongs in their eyes even if the subscriber base is rapidly dieing in the background.
    No, you're an obsessive tool. Just because people can enjoy something you don't like doesn't make them bad in any way. Especially when we're talking about a video game. People don't post because NOT EVERYONE GOES TO FORUMS. Check out the activity community numbers for any game, I'd bet money you won't find a single community, no matter how big, that has more than 10% active members on their forums compared to their estimated total player base.

    The company does plenty wrong in my eyes and has for years (I'm a fucking Puppetmaster since the beginning, I've got more to complain about than most of the community purely on that basis. Not to mention my earlier time as DRG and SMN), but I'll defend them in scenarios where rampant negativity not only doesn't serve a purpose but isn't justifiable.

    I'm in full support of what LuvBunny has been saying and no amount of arse kissing from condescending tools is going to change those opinions. I believe the developments direction is headed the wrong way and we'll soon see results that shed light on reality over blind support. What I see is the blind leading the blind not the other way around.
    The irony of this is amazing to me. It is one thing to have conflicting opinions with people, but to follow someone purely because the general tonality of their opinion maxes the sensationalism you feel is necessary is just asinine. I'm sorry, but if the game is so far gone that it makes you so angry, you should probably step back and re-evaluate your 14 dollar investment.

    I have plenty of problems with the game -- and more problems with the community -- because I seldom find myself so engrossed in my displeasure with the go-nowhere-because-we're-trying-to-by-time updates nor the dick measuring contest elitism that I actually insult individuals GENERALLY. Even at in my angriest, most condescending posts I try to maintain that the overall purpose is a pointing towards logic and practicality in some fashion.

    I just don't get why you folks, who try to claim that everyone who doesn't agree with you is a blind idiot, are even here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Luvbunny View Post
    Yes, I have been doing the delivery one so far, since it is less "lag" and non combat related. And yeah I stored the tags by signing up for ones I never intended to do and retrieve them later so I can spam 30 tags at once. It still does not solve the lag issue on the reives, the fact that mages still not earning enough bayld, and the fact that you have to do so many of these to rank up on each individual coalition. It's a decent start, maybe in 4-6 months it will be more bearable, assuming more people are doing it and they must love whacking roots since that is all there is to do for peacekeepers, in every single zone... I rather do a kill 5 mobs type of activities and get rewarded.
    I was in a group with a summoner who claimed to be earning 2-3k per reive spamming AoE heals with Carbuncle... So I'm going to have to disagree.

    I have a friend (all she plays is SMN and WHM) who loves reives and has earned over 150k just from doing them for a few hours each day with her husband and their LS. Last time I asked her, she was approaching 200k -- it is really just about sticking to it -- just like building chains in abyssea. What you need to do is accept that you have to work with groups to get good rewards. I went on Geomancer for like 15 minute minutes and earned almost 600 bayld for 3 reives... so I don't get this claim that mages aren't getting credit.

    Sorry that you don't get rewarded for barely trying, but complaining that you don't get rewarded for less than half an hour's investment is like me claiming I should be able to buy all of my the AF3+2 for all of my jobs (I really need to stop leveling jobs to 99, as a side note...) because I have "Better things to do."

    Fun fact, Reives can be a 5-6 man event. Moh Gates tends to be empty, and with a PLD or DNC you can cap your contribution pretty dang quickly by focusing on the mobs instead of on the roots.
    (5)
    Last edited by Horadrim; 04-23-2013 at 12:53 AM.
    Somewhere in space... this could be happening right now.

  9. #29
    Player
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ru'Lude Gardens!
    Posts
    4,310
    I love how I'm an obsessive tool defending SE who I believe can do no wrong, even though most of the time I complain about almost every post that is made by them. Fact is, the expansion is new, I myself am willing to give them some time before I go out and say they fucked up, its simply a matter of patience, I rather wait and give good feedback and see where it goes than to simply drop it and say it sucks.
    (5)

  10. #30
    Player Luvbunny's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,395
    Character
    Luvbunny
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Yinnyth View Post
    Roots, rocks, and nests are what you do for bayld so you can get access to other things. Just like how you don't actually want to kill Baba Yaga repeatedly, you just want to pop Carabosse so you can get gems from her over and over again until you have enough to upgrade your empy to the next level.
    LMAO you are comparing SoA to Abyssea which is a huge difference. Carabose kill can be repeated over and over solo or duo, yes it is annoying when you come there on a busy night, the same goes to Heqet and Gukumatz. Huge difference. You can't really solo the reives, a minimum of 3-4 people is required since there are 2 things to do.

    I am realistic, I know they will need a good year to make SoA somewhat interesting (hopefully I am wrong and within 3 updates, they can fix TONS of thing). But you guys should look back at the history, which often repeat itself over and over. Anything that requires server wide participation usually die down once the glitter and luster is wearing off, thus new players or returning players in 2014 would probably have a harder time clearing the game. Abyssea is different - it lets you to just log and play, solo or duo, trio or 6 man, or alliance. From total noob to expert, all are being rewarded all the same.

    I think they even know about this, hence a lot of recent content pre SoA are geared toward 3-6 people. And the mighty Voidwatch also given some sort of weakening items so that less than 18 people can clear it. I also realize that general players do not respond too well on "assault type" activities, anything with tags that required "Static" group. It's surprising that Meeble is not that popular since the activities are varied and it required teamwork. The reality is, the mentality of the players changed, they now want a "log and play" type of events. Not something that required solid static and lots of investment. But more of a short burst of "drugs", you do it quickly, you get the rush, you log off. That's why it's hard to kill Abyssea - it gives you exactly that, ability to mix and match the atmas, and have fun at each of the 22 jobs without being restricted.

    In all honesty, this game is all about grinding to infinity, and beyond, over and over. But there are fun grind and there are boring grind. Obviously it would be different from person to person. SE tends to "move on" and quickly forget older contents even if people are still interested and hoping for some sort of fixes. Campaign and Walk of Echoes are good example of contents that are quickly forgotten by the developer. People asked for single entrants for Assaults and Salvage, yet being ignored still to this day. So what's to say that a year from now, nothing will be done over Reives, and it too, will be forgotten by the developer.

    All will depend on FF14, if the ARR launch is successful and managed to move a great deal of FFXI subscribers plus a bunch of new players (and returning players) then FFXI will die down very slowly till it no longer generate enough profit. If ARR failed to attract a good numbers, then they will have to do another add ons similar to Abyssea that inject a huge dose of fun to FFXI to maintain interest. At least till ARR can be deemed profitable, which probably once they release the first expansion. As you are well aware, tons of promised contents have been scaled back in FF14:ARR, no longer be available on launch day.
    (1)

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