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  1. #1
    Player Asymptotic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Windurst
    Posts
    656
    Character
    Sylow
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    DNC Lv 99

    Mythic Weaponskill Skillchain Properties

    Mythics are widely regarded as the hardest-to-obtain "ultimate weapons" in FFXI, and yet they boast a glaring weakness when compared to the other "ultimate weapons," largely due to the design of the Mythic Weapon Skills.

    While a lot of these weapon skills are weaker than their alternatives, they also fail to have "level 3" skillchain properties similar to Relic and Empyrean weapon skills.

    While understandable in the general sense, since all players have access to the Mythic Weapon Skills regardless of weapon, but if it were possible would it be possible to add level 3 skillchain properties to Mythic Weapon Skills when used by someone wielding a Mythic Weapon?
    (16)

  2. #2
    Player Kincard's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    648
    Character
    Kincard
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    At this point I would really love any further info on REM adjustments in general. When Lv99/AG was added, they implied they planned on adding further stats/properties onto some (all) of the REM weapons. Whether that is in planning or just completely scrapped, I would really love to know.
    (2)

  3. #3
    Player Byrth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    2,172
    Character
    Byrth
    World
    Lakshmi
    Main Class
    DNC Lv 99
    I would also love the proposed adjustment.
    (2)

  4. #4
    Player Tsukino_Kaji's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    4,028
    Character
    Tsukinokaji
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    WHM Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Asymptotic View Post
    Mythics are widely regarded as the hardest-to-obtain "ultimate weapons" in FFXI
    Only since teh change to dynamis and mythincs themselves haven't changed at all. It's simply a lack of market, not a dificulty to obtain.
    (0)

  5. #5
    Player Byrth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    2,172
    Character
    Byrth
    World
    Lakshmi
    Main Class
    DNC Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji View Post
    Only since teh change to dynamis and mythincs themselves haven't changed at all. It's simply a lack of market, not a dificulty to obtain.
    This is an interesting claim, so lets examine it:

    * Relics cost ~200mil and require Dynamis - Bastok/Sandy/Windy/Jeuno/Beaucedine clears and level 65.

    * Mythics cost ~500mil and additionally require that you've obtained level 65, done every assault twice, killed 3 24~??? hour NMs, cleared 4 Salvage zones, collected 150,000 Nyzul Isle tokens, collected 100,000 Ampuoles, beaten Odin, and collected three Tier 4 ZNM trophies.

    It appears that the facts indicate mythics are more difficult to obtain than relics, unless getting 5 Dynamis clears is somehow harder than doing all of that ToAU content and is worth an additional 300mil.
    (9)

  6. #6
    Player
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,401
    They probably decided to NOT do this since Mythics in general are already stronger than Relics/Empyreans so this was the 'balance'. If they could continue Lv3 it would make KKK,Ryunohige,Kogarasumaru go from overpowered to ludicrous.
    (0)

  7. #7
    Player Kincard's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    648
    Character
    Kincard
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Ophannus View Post
    They probably decided to NOT do this since Mythics in general are already stronger than Relics/Empyreans so this was the 'balance'. If they could continue Lv3 it would make KKK,Ryunohige,Kogarasumaru go from overpowered to ludicrous.
    It's all over the place, really. It's actually kinda ridiculous how big the gap the strength between the weapons are. I think Ryunohige is probably the strongest weapon in the game by a really, really large margin. (Stat-wise and how the stats synergize with each other etc) Then you have stuff like Tupsimati and Murgleis that don't seem to serve any real purpose other than look (really frickin') cool. I realize that lots of people argue that Claustrum and such are crappy relics, but they actually serve their purpose in some fashion still (Claustrum still is the the highest D staff despite any arguments to its practicality of use, etc).

    Only since teh change to dynamis and mythincs themselves haven't changed at all. It's simply a lack of market, not a dificulty to obtain.
    Even back when Alexandrites were priced at 5k or so (So total cost was about equal to relics), Mythics were considered far more difficult because of how much endgame content you had to spam. Beastmen Kings, Odin, Nyzul Isle, 50 assaults, Einherjar, 3 ZNM Kings...definately a lot more to do than a fragment, necropsyche and animated weapon.
    (4)
    Last edited by Kincard; 01-04-2013 at 09:18 AM.

  8. #8
    Player detlef's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,645
    Character
    Philemon
    World
    Valefor
    Main Class
    BRD Lv 99
    An argument can be made that the beastman kings are significantly more difficult to defeat nowadays, for what that's worth.

    But yes, I would really appreciate if Drakesbane would have better skillchain properties (while you're down there, remove that pesky attack penalty please).
    (0)

  9. #9
    Player ManaKing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    920
    Character
    Iocus
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    RDM Lv 99
    Everyone has at least a Relic or Empy if they have played for any significant amount of time and actually wanted to take the time to make one. Very few, and fewer still since people quit, have Mythics. They are clearly the most time consuming and are the only one of the prestige weapons to require multiple people working together to build, regardless of level (if you aren't paying for multiple accounts or cheating). Furthermore, Mythics make up less than 5% of the total amount of prestige weapons in the game in last year's census. Don't sugar coat Mythics. They are hard to get and more take time compared to almost anything else in the game.

    These should be custom tailored weapons that should be balanced around the individual jobs that can use them. They should be the best weapons in the game for every job, especially since they take the most time invested to acquire. There is no reason you shouldn't make each Mythic outlandishly good for each job, since only 1 job can use it. Not necessarily in the form of total damage (even though AM3 generally accomplishes that), but SOMETHING that every job should go, 'well damn, I really want that' See Yagrush for valid example. Some Mythics are kinda close, but others really could use a lot of work considering how much the game has changed.

    That being said, their SC properties are fine. Pretty much all Mythics have lvl 2 SC properties that make dark or light if you combine them with the appropriate other lvl 2 SC property. (Not so much on Yagrush, oh noes not the Melee-WHM, SC makes them broken powerful...said no one ever.) At the end of the day Lvl 3 means you have a 50% chance of making a SC on accident and Lvl 2 SC properties drop it to 25% (unless it is double lvl 2 like RDM and BRD mythic WSs). SCs don't really work against a lot of mobs anymore because of higher tier mobs ridiculous magic evasion, -MDT, MDB, or something else that makes SC damage increasingly unreliable. Against most things that you would fight with a small party you can still probably SC things dead, much like I do, and enjoy it. The issue really isn't the Mythic WSs SC properties, and is actually SCs in general becoming more and more antiquated.

    The other advantage to lvl 3 SC props is that you just spam the same WS back to back and get SCs. IMHO that is a mildly lazy approach to SCing. You can generally have access to Trial, Mythic, Merit, and a Prestige WS all at the same time. It's just not that hard for most jobs to make Dark and/or Light anymore.
    (0)
    I'm a RequieSCAT-MAN!

  10. #10
    Player ManaKing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    920
    Character
    Iocus
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    RDM Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Kincard View Post
    It's all over the place, really. It's actually kinda ridiculous how big the gap the strength between the weapons are. I think Ryunohige is probably the strongest weapon in the game by a really, really large margin. (Stat-wise and how the stats synergize with each other etc) Then you have stuff like Tupsimati and Murgleis that don't seem to serve any real purpose other than look (really frickin') cool. I realize that lots of people argue that Claustrum and such are crappy relics, but they actually serve their purpose in some fashion still (Claustrum still is the the highest D staff despite any arguments to its practicality of use, etc).
    Claustrum can still Dispel 2Hs so in the right scenerio, it actually is really cool. BUT it's a big stick. And not any kind of exceptional big stick. Just a stick. Is disappointed. I would want something else for either a BLM or a SMN, so I would agree that it's not a very good thing to spend that much time and money on.

    Murgleis' Convert Augmentation is very weak compared to something like Yagrush's Augments. The only redeeming quality of Murgleis is that it is the highest DPS 1h Mythic and that Death Blossom is actually a good WS. Not an amazing WS, but a good one. I doubt I would ever be able to pick a mythic over it because I'm a crazy RDM, but I really wish they would put something better on it besides a gorgeously designed sword to make it a higher priority.
    (0)
    I'm a RequieSCAT-MAN!

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