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  1. #41
    Player Einalem's Avatar
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    Apr 2011
    Posts
    49
    Character
    Einalem
    World
    Quetzalcoatl
    Main Class
    SCH Lv 99
    While not a popular answer, I'm sure: I can understand making Embrava Refresh instead of Regain, just not for endgame. SCH lacking Refresh and not being able to stack Refresh and Sublimation can be an issue in mid levels. This change would be very nice in a traditional (2008) leveling scenario. Due to endgame content, the currently proposed and thankfully held-off nerf doesn't make sense.

    Let's not beat around the bush though! Our post 75 spells and skills and even certain others we complain about regularly *cough Modus Veritas cough* are not in a place they should be. If they were this nerf would honestly matter less. Square, don't put the cart in front of the horse! Fix the already broken SCH abilities before nerfing the one good thing we have going for us post 75. And in case it really has to be reiterrated, this means:
    Adloquium being non scaling/weak
    Animus not stacking Pax, not affecting real current hate values, etc
    Modus Veritas just being a waste even against non-boss monsters
    Libra not having any range and an awkward display for values in an Alliance/Party.

    Fix this stuff before any nerf.
    (3)

  2. #42
    Player Mookies75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    59
    Character
    Mookies
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    WAR Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Damane View Post
    Flexibility, but thats something you dont seem to be aware of.
    Dont get me wrong, Embrava was really nice. I dont feel screwed as a SCH over the nerf, but I feel screwed about the so said "adjustments" they are doing to Legion, ADL, Odin etc. Which really arent any adjustments at all.

    Granted the nerf went a bit overboard. I would have rather had a nerf in potency of Haste regain and regen then the duration cut down. But hey they went with nerfing potency and nerfing duration. 2 nerfs for the price of 1!
    Let me explain something to you since you seem hopelessly oblivious to it... After this nerf goes through, there is almost no reason to even play sch as a main job. What? Are people going to take you for your sub par nukes instead of a BLM? Are they going to take you for your cheesy utterly useless utility spells, why not take a rdm instead if you were going to do that? Are they going to take you for regen 5? Are they going to take you for the new lolbrava? No.

    There is nothing SCH can do that another job can't do better. There is no reason to have a jack of all trades but master of none in the alliance unless they just feel bad for you. Essentially I would rate SCH post nerf 2nd most useless and pointless main job in the game right now. There is no reason to go past 49 on it from nerf patch forward.
    (4)

  3. #43
    Player Arcon's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Location
    San d'Oria
    Posts
    2,753
    Character
    Arcon
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    PLD Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Mookies75 View Post
    Let me explain something to you since you seem hopelessly oblivious to it... After this nerf goes through, there is almost no reason to even play sch as a main job. What? Are people going to take you for your sub par nukes instead of a BLM? Are they going to take you for your cheesy utterly useless utility spells, why not take a rdm instead if you were going to do that? Are they going to take you for regen 5? Are they going to take you for the new lolbrava? No.

    There is nothing SCH can do that another job can't do better. [..]
    Let me explain something to you since you seem hopelessly oblivious to it. SCH is the best stunner in the game. That alone is reason enough why SCH will have a place in important events. SCH is also the best nuker in the game. And unlike BLM it can function as an emergency AoE healer/eraser at a moment's notice.

    Now let me ask you something, did you enjoy playing Embrava whore? What's the point of "getting to play SCH", when in reality you're not playing SCH, you're playing a dude who just casts Embrava on everyone and locks onto a target for the rest of the event (I know that's no longer an option, but doesn't change the point)? Being wanted for one buff only is not job inclusion. It's the same reason why wanting a THF for TH is not good for the THF. No one wants to sit on the sidelines and just apply TH (or Embrava), that's not playing a job, that's wasting a party spot that could have gone to someone better but didn't because of one single aspect that was wanted or needed that this job provided.

    And still, even if any of what you said made sense, Embrava should have still been nerfed, because it was broken. There is no denying that. If SE wants to promote job inclusion they should make jobs reasonably useful, not hopelessly overpowered.
    (8)
    All affirmations are true in some sense, false in some sense, meaningless in some sense, true and false in some sense, true and meaningless in some sense, false and meaningless in some sense, and true and false and meaningless in some sense.
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    FFXI: Leviathan > Arcon
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  4. #44
    Player
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    Mar 2011
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    Ru'Lude Gardens!
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    4,310
    Quote Originally Posted by Mookies75 View Post
    Let me explain something to you since you seem hopelessly oblivious to it... After this nerf goes through, there is almost no reason to even play sch as a main job.
    I do not main SCH, however I do like the job a lot and play it quite often so I feel like responding to this.

    What? Are people going to take you for your sub par nukes instead of a BLM?
    With correct use of weather SCH can hit harder with single target nukes than a BLM can, however they cast slower which is their flaw.

    Are they going to take you for your cheesy utterly useless utility spells, why not take a rdm instead if you were going to do that?
    Because RDM has no real utility spells, RDM has almost nothing you can not get with SCH using RDM as a sub-job, which is actually the best setup for SCH in most situations, to have RDM as a sub-job. RDMs only unique buffs, Phalanx and Enspells, which are able to hit other players under any circumstance are available to SCH with subbing RDM, and they have the exact same potency. In other words, rather than saying "Why bring SCH when you can bring RDM" is really more or less the opposite of what happens, because everything RDM has unique about itself that helps others is basically accessible from a sub-job standpoint.

    Are they going to take you for regen 5?
    Actually yes, in events like Meeble Burrows, Nyzul Isle, Salvage, really any event where you are not fighting only bosses, SCH is an amazing healer, part of which is because Cure IVs can stand up to the same power as Cure Vs with proper gear, which helps with MP, the other reason is due to Regen V. Regen V is 69HP/Tick for 100MP, can make it last up to 2 and a half minutes, so you get an amazing 50 ticks, that is a grand total of 3450 HP over the course of 2 and a half minutes. On anything not hitting increadably hard it allows the SCH many options, buffing, /healing, splitting up from the group, and all of this is because the SCH has a healing over time spell that is keeping the others alive for them while they are not healing. I personally bring SCH to any event that is not just bosses, as the primary healer instead of a WHM because of Regen and its other good uses, like Phalanxga and Regain while we are on the move.

    Are they going to take you for the new lolbrava? No.
    Only for that? No, however, the spell still works well for some things. For instance in Neo-Salvage I have 2 SCHs, 1 for the NQ and 1 for the HQ bosses, each of the SCHs 2 hour. Embrava works well for keeping the party alive from small damage numbers, the Refresh easily helps you keep your MP up, and the Haste helps kill a bit faster. Is the spell as amazing as it used to be? No, not in a damage stand point, I believe the spell should have a longer duration as well, but the overall effects I have to say feel better to me post-nerf than pre-nerf, as much as people hate it. Also as a side note, for both the NQ and HQ Kaustra is very effective for keeping the Regen on Hydra down, and dealing some good damage over time in other cases, making it a useful spell, even if people normally scoff at the though of it by compare to Embrava.

    There is nothing SCH can do that another job can't do better. There is no reason to have a jack of all trades but master of none in the alliance unless they just feel bad for you. Essentially I would rate SCH post nerf 2nd most useless and pointless main job in the game right now. There is no reason to go past 49 on it from nerf patch forward.
    Regen, DoT, Cure IV, single target nuke, buff a party. Yes, SCH has things it can do better, WHM is better in large party situations, or against large enemies, BLM is better in cases where you need magic damage on multiple enemies. In reality, SCH is a very powerful job, I love the job, and I think its one of the best jobs in the game. Unlike RDM, it has unique things about it, and a lot of power in the areas it is not focused in, not to mention in some ways it can out perform the general task of another job. In this case, it can in some situations heal better and buff better than a WHM, while it can nuke single targets for more damage, even if they have a longer cast time. SCH also has the second most MP sustainability with Sublimation, next to RDM with Refresh II.

    The way you speak is as though Embrava was all that made SCH a job, thats not a job, its a spell. SCH as a job has a lot of strength, Embrava is being nerfed, so it loses some power, but it still is a good job over all, when they nerf Regen, removed SCHs ability to use weather bonus so well, and they kill off Kaustra's DoT effects, then yes, SCH will be a weak job, but till then I believe the job is strong and worth bringing to many low man, or dungeon-like events.
    (11)

  5. #45
    Player shaheen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1
    Character
    Shaheen
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    WAR Lv 99
    I level up sch to 99 just to find pty to do NNI to use Embrava and regain is one of the main obective to get an invite. now i say goodbye NNI invite since you only get invite if you have relic weapon or static party. there are some improvement but changing Embrava cotent is a wrong choice..I simpaly loss my interest to play the game since not maney chance for people to invite regular job without Relic weapons
    (1)

  6. #46
    Player
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    Mar 2011
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    Ru'Lude Gardens!
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    4,310
    Quote Originally Posted by shaheen View Post
    I level up sch to 99 just to find pty to do NNI to use Embrava and regain is one of the main obective to get an invite. now i say goodbye NNI invite since you only get invite if you have relic weapon or static party. there are some improvement but changing Embrava cotent is a wrong choice..I simpaly loss my interest to play the game since not maney chance for people to invite regular job without Relic weapons
    New NNI still needs SCH, it will be SCH BRD and 4 DDs, people do not say they want only relic DDs, they want heavy DDs with Emp/Relic and I can assure you if you have a good enough weapon most groups will take you on a heavy DD job, some weapons for example are the OAT GS for DRK, or TP GK for SAM. SCH is still needed because it needs to cast Regen V and Pro/Shell on everyone, BRD has to do double marches. SCH can also use Adlo for Regain and Phalanx for less damage taken, together it basically covers everything Embrava did except for the Regain you are losing, and is not all that hard to do if people keep track on timers for buffs.
    (2)

  7. #47
    Player
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    Mar 2011
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    283
    all good points im still mad though
    (1)
    Last edited by Ezikiel; 03-30-2013 at 11:41 PM.

  8. #48
    Player
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    Mar 2011
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    Ru'Lude Gardens!
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    4,310
    I am not really happy about the changes to Embrava myself. There was a middle ground to be found, they took the duration from 5 minutes to 90 seconds for example. Simply changing it to 3 minutes would have been fine, it would have much lower, even with all extra duration bonus we would still only hit 7.5 minutes, which sounds fair to me, thats 3/5th of the old time. Even 2 minutes, would have been better, right now I can pop it at the start of a short boss fight in Meebles and it wears before we get the mob to 25%, which on some of them like Samursk is a real problem. Refresh rather than Regain is really just a bunch of DDs whining about not getting more DPS, its a good change, it really does help mages, it would just be nice if the duration was not trash, and the regen is still there and full potency which is fine too, just as it should be.

    Basically, my entire problem is the duration.
    (2)

  9. #49
    Player Kokorololi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    20
    Character
    Ciato
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    SCH Lv 99
    Meanwhile, almost every other job's SP lasts 30-60 seconds.

    It needed to be nerfed, and it needed to be nerfed bad. I'm sad it got nerfed, but it was too good to last. I'm amazed it got greenlit to begin with. It's still extremely powerful as it is. Plus we still have Kaustra and 180-210 seconds of free strategems during our SP.
    (2)

  10. #50
    Player Luvbunny's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,395
    Character
    Luvbunny
    World
    Bahamut
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Please let's not post how good the rest of what Scholar can do here, we do not need another "adjustment". We know the job is good, and loosing the regain factor is not a huge big deal since you still have the tp regain spell, yes it is 1 tp, but better than zero. I only wish they would just keep the longer duration and loose the regain. There are tons of things that Scholar can do in a party, especially for small party events. For those who only level it for Embrava NNI, congratulations, now you actually have to learn the job properly, or go back and level another hot jobs at the moment - until further adjustment is made to those said jobs.
    (1)

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