Legion, current playerbase and endgame content

[Byrth]

yeah honestly if you are good at farming adl and sell marrows, alexandrites farming is a joke ("only" 500M or 36 marrows), so in reality the hardest thing to do would be an afterglow mythic. Too bad they all suck kindof.

No one kills Pandemonium Warden anymore or I'd consider afterglowing Terpsichore! The weapon doesn't turn DNC into a demigod, but DNC is a job that thrives on swag so I think it's pretty justified. If you guys figure out a way triple-box PW, let me know, lol.

[Afania]

Funny how we went from talking about how gear from Legion is good or useful, to me judging others & being hypocritical because of my general outlook on Afterglow in response to what Arcon said... Suppose I should have just said Afterglow is meaningless to me in every way and would not change my outlook at what I perceive as someones ignorance toward gear.

This is more about you calling others selfish for making afterglow/worthless upgrade. I don't care if you think afterglow is useless and I will never put a gun in your head and force you to do it or convince you to do it, because it's your personal opinion. I don't care if someone thinks afterglow is awesome accomplishment because that's his opinion and not mine. I don't care about whether pchan is ignorance toward gear or not, because it's also your opinion and his opinion towards gear. I don't care if you call greedy LS leader who slaving others to make gil selfish or ppl who only ask for help but never help back selfish because that does fits the meaning of selfish.

Afterglow is simply an expensive situational upgrade for me and that's it. But whether ppl do it for standing glow in PJ, or ppl do it for improving performance in mind is none of my concern.


But I disagree with you calling ppl selfish for making afterglow with their own gil, because to an extend that implys me, and majority of players who doesn't hand out gil and buys very situational gear that almost never have a use selfish too. And that's direct towards person, not job/gear. Calling a job/gear worthless is different from calling other ppl selfish for spending gil.

Anyways back to legion ._.

[Glamdring]

a very good way for SE to look at addressing the difficulty of Mul is to make the "required" gear (and a good player can overcome that requirement) drop from the earlier halls with sufficient regularity that a group that does the work can see sufficient players reach the point of gearing for Mul with a month or 2 of play for sufficient members to beat Mul. Yes, that means adjusting drop rates, not an SE fave activity. Point is, if you do the work, beat the content, and learn to be a tight crew then the end goal should be acheivable, but that's not necessarily the case with legion. I know a couple of groups that run, and knowing the players involved I have a pretty good idea of the skill level; it doesn't seem right that the below average group is doing just as well as the well above average group. But if you measue success by the reward accumulation, they are.

Personally, I like bringing back a big, alliance based system. I do think that Mul (and a couple others) scaling adjustment to the 18-36 alliance thing hasn't been properly implemented, and the number of Mul defeats for 18s seems to bear that out. So basically, address the earlier drop rates and reexamine the scaling mechanism.

[Nala]

Just quick replying to OP, i would love to see legion further adjusted especially with incoming PD and Embrava nerfs, but as it stands my current linkshell is super low man, even with our mules we wouldn't have enough people to take on Legion.

That and other then the honor's the rewards seem somewhat lackluster, not to say there isnt gear i want from legion.

[wish12oz]

My new pimpass afterglow spharai is benefiting from +5% crit from mdk's afterglow (all this because final heaven sux)

Know what would of benefited the two of you more? Using some of that gil to buy Neo Nyzul drops because you can't beat the event on your own.

Neo Nyzul gear > useless glowing.

[saevel]

I) I understand the "other events" thing, and I suppose for some groups with limited event time it's a matter of what other remaining goals people have unfulfilled. To me, Legion is where you go to do those final tweaks on jobs once you have most everything else. And I never advocate doing Legion instead of Neo-Nyzul, if it comes down to a choice amongst limited gameplay time.

II) The effort/reward thing I can understand as well, but only to a point:

a) If "time" is the issue, the event is 30 minutes. Assuming a LS has 18 regularly-showing people (which you likely have if you are running events like Prov Watcher), Legion takes as much time or less than those other events. It is a decent complement to ADL runs. Indeed, once a group gets experience, they can just farm lower chambers for trophies and do a Mul run each time they meet, which has 90-95% of the worthwhile drops in Legion. The whole thing takes about 1.5 hours, which is about as much time as your average /shout Prov Watcher group takes for drop rates a fraction of the size. Arguably, 1.5 hours for access to the above list of drops is actually a BETTER effort/reward ratio than the constantly disappointing Prov Watcher, especially when certain stuff like Meteor/Arise has a 100% drop slot. People tend to go home with SOMETHING in my Legion runs, unlike Prov Watcher where they just go home with hatred toward Tanaka.

b) If "hassle/headache" is the issue (i.e., the X-factor) I can understand that much more. Leading one of these runs can be challenging, and there are nights I just don't want to deal with it in my LS. Again, it's all a matter of who you have in your group. Most of the people in both my LS and the side group with which I run are hungry for new events and love the adrenaline rush Legion can give. They don't consider it a hassle or a headache.

III) As for rewards and Pchan's continuing zeal to justify not doing the event, they have been discussed ad nauseum. There are no groundbreaking pieces in Legion, except maybe for SMN. For most people, there are undeniable upgrades (however slight) for people who have everything else. Pchan just listing that "stuff fails" does not, in and of itself, make something fail. He has thankfully conceded the usefulness of Esper Earring, Ngen Seraweels, and Duplus Grip, but he has no conception that someone who plays BLU might get use out of an A'as Circlet, or that a BLM might want a Maniacus Sash, or that a DRK might want Striga Crown, or that certain melee can benefit from Wurrukatte Boots and Huginn Gambieras, or that if everybody took his advice and didn't do the event there would not BE a stream of buyable Legion drops on the AH or in peoples' bazaars (especially Meteor/Arise since Prov Watcher is notoriously stingy). Instead, we get a constant and unending stream of dead-end MNK-skewed ad hominem jabs.

I'm not pchan lol. I mentioned that event is largely side-grades or slight upgrades / situation pieces. If you have members who want it then it's perfectly fine to do so. LS's exist to get members gear and to provide a pool of resources to execute more difficult content. If a LS's member base wants stuff from legion and is willing to put in the effort to obtain it, then obviously the answer is to do it.

We have three event days per week. Due to us being compromised of both NA and EU members attendance can be sketchy at every day except Sunday. Myself playing from the KST/JST region doesn't help that fact. Wednesdays are typically split into NA and EU sub-events that focus on ABC farming and ADL pop set farming. Drunken vent friday's tend to be mostly EU with the NA's showing up later as they get off work, so we do whatever we have the members for, kind of a wild car day. That leaves epic marathon sundays for our events, typically double PW, ADL killing (if we didn't do it Friday), Arch Omega / Ultima, and whatever else the membership wants dead. We've done 12~18 Bismark / Morta / Rex's before, or just did a Jeuno T4~T6 full clear (for newer members). To fit in legion we'd have to axe some things that members want.

Now things like NNI / Meebles and such happen all the time, usually Saturdays or whenever members organize their own statics. Though for a long time we were bringing our members through NNI to get them gear from there.

The only drops worth a damn from Legion come from Mul which is a Rag zerg fest and requires pretty specific setups to pull off. Your looking at four clears per Mul run at 30m each so 2.5hrs per Mul. This wouldn't be bad if it wasn't for the horde of SMN's you need to bring in with you along with the two to three SCH's. It's an event where you have 1 DD party that you super buff then abuse PD / Alacrity stun cycling to make the NM's do nothing while you beat them down with impunity. It's doable but a royal PITA to setup. There is a reason all the legion gear is stupidly overpriced right now. PW runs are more entertaining then Legion which is pretty much "deny the NM all action or die".

[MarkovChain]

No one kills Pandemonium Warden anymore or I'd consider afterglowing Terpsichore! The weapon doesn't turn DNC into a demigod, but DNC is a job that thrives on swag so I think it's pretty justified. If you guys figure out a way triple-box PW, let me know, lol.

Triple box adl is possible if :

2 MNKs 1 SMN
on the SMN's mules you have a BRD and a COR.

However it's going to be long, you can pop maybe 4 per run if you are organised (like if you have a second SMN on the SMN).

With the marrows buy mulcibar, pb solved. Only need like 75 marrows.

[Monchat]

No one kills Pandemonium Warden anymore or I'd consider afterglowing Terpsichore! The weapon doesn't turn DNC into a demigod, but DNC is a job that thrives on swag so I think it's pretty justified. If you guys figure out a way triple-box PW, let me know, lol.

I thought it was 6 man zergable?

[Monchat]

Know what would of benefited the two of you more? Using some of that gil to buy Neo Nyzul drops because you can't beat the event on your own.

Neo Nyzul gear > useless glowing.

We have our nyzul items last I checked. Yes we 6 box nyzul. You think your are 1337 because you can kill level 80 EP mobs fast adn win 59~75% of the time with secret ninja techniques?

[Byrth]

I thought it was 6 man zergable?

It probably is, but that's only the final form. It takes like 15 minutes of killing the other forms and avoiding getting killed by lamps to start the final form (-aga III spam from 8 lamps still hurts). It's probably possible with 6 people (PLD, WHM, DDx3, BRD), but 6 people isn't triple-boxing.

The problem with just trying to buy Mulcibar is that there's very little / no supply of it. There's 1 in a bazaar picked up by guildwork on my server and 28 across servers (some obviously not for sale). For Marrows there are 37 in bazaars on my server and probably 24 that people are actually trying to sell. If I could kill PW solo, though, buying pops for him would be very easy. I bet I could get 50 Scoria at ~1mil each before my supply of people with pops they want to get rid of dries up.


PS. on topic:
Saeval, you only need to clear the first wave of the 4 starting chambers to do Mul, which takes <5 minutes after buffing with a good group. Our time record so far is about an 1:15 from our gather time to clearing Mul. On average I'd say it takes us about as long to do Legion as to get a group together and do Pandemonium Warden.