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  1. #11
    Player Bulrogg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Carbuncle: Windurst Militia
    Posts
    419
    Uzura+1/Kamome still working on helms/skins for Kannagi
    the belt is for the Attk and DblAttk
    (0)

  2. #12
    Player Nattack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    145
    Character
    Nattack
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    DRK Lv 99
    CritRate > STR > DEX i believe it is, unless some piece of the gear has overwhelming stats.

    That's why Senjuinrikio has been king for many, many years.
    (0)
    You can't even hold it.

  3. #13
    Player Invasion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    48
    Character
    Turdinator
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    WHM Lv 99
    More STR than DEX inside Abyssea if you use RR/GH. Also it is debatable whether WS Gorget/Belts are still worthwhile for multi-hit WS as the accuracy gained isn't as big a deal as it once was. The actual damaged gained from the ftp increase may not surpass the STR you can get from some pieces as it only applies to the first hit of the WS, not all 3.

    For a better understanding click Here.
    (0)

  4. #14
    Player Een's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    San d'oria
    Posts
    24
    Character
    Een
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 95
    There isn't a priority over one another as far as STR and DEX. They are BOTH 30% multipliers.

    But if you wanted to put one over the other, DEX > STR since Jin is a Critical hit rate WS, Dex is what decides your Critical hit rate, ACC, AND its a 30% multiplier.

    And, if you wanted to prioritize them in order its Katana skill>Critical Hit rate>STR&DEX are equals@30%modifiers > Attack is last really...

    Merit that Katana skill, make sure it's capped, cap critical hit rate and cap both str and dex in merits equally...the multipliers make them equal. I've broke 2500..do it pretty constantly with only a few pieces of IGA+2 gear and then the remainder of other gear. Especially in Abyssea I break 2500.

    At 75 in a burn pt before Abyssea, I did 2123 Blade: Jin with my old school set up. Basically everything listed below if you take the Iga out of the list. Max Katana, Critical Hit rate, Fudo off hand

    Main: Senji Offhand: Kamome
    Head: Optical Hat forever, just for the ACC, but there are other helms out now...Iga+1 and Iga+2 is best tho.
    Body: Kirin's Osode til IGA+
    Hands: Ochimusha Kote til IGA+
    Legs: Byakko's Haidate til IGA+
    Feet: Rutter Sabatons or if your Hume, level 60 RSE feet. til IGA+
    Waist: Warwolf Belt
    Neck: Chivalrous chain is acceptable, helps with ACC (Gave up on the WS gorget, doesn't seem to really help anymore.) But for max damage, and this is MY opinion, use the Katana Skill Gorget.
    Back:Cuchulain's Mantle if you can afford it, Cerb mantle is good enough, or Commander's +3 str dex agi
    Rings: I use 1 Flame and 1 Breeze or whatever gives +5 dex, I forget. Plan to get +7 rings when prices lower. 1 STR 1 DEX
    Earrings: I do have 2 +2 Dex earrings but I was able to afford it back in the day because of my Smithing skill..was able to make some HQ gear for a 100+3 GS'er...not recommended to go broke over tho. Minuet earring and whatever else is suitable for WS macro.

    I have max Katana Skill, I'd suggest the katana skill gorget over the WS dmg Gorget anyday IMO. I think those WS gorgets are broke now.
    (0)
    Last edited by Een; 03-16-2011 at 01:29 PM.
    "Live for the Fight, Die for the Glory"

  5. #15
    Player Nattack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    145
    Character
    Nattack
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    DRK Lv 99
    under what notion do your WS gorgets no longer help?

    also hitting a high jin once doesnt really mean much :\
    (0)
    Last edited by Nattack; 03-16-2011 at 02:52 PM.
    You can't even hold it.

  6. #16
    Player Faule's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    62
    Character
    Langly
    World
    Quetzalcoatl
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Een View Post
    There isn't a priority over one another as far as STR and DEX. They are BOTH 30% multipliers.
    I'm going to disagree with this point. You are right, they are 30% modifiers, but, Strength is also compared to the enemies Vitality. This comparison in turn adds to the base damage of our weapon, up to a specific cap (depending on the current base damage of your katana).

    What this means is unless you're hitting that cap between your Strength and the enemies Vitality, strength is going to outweigh Dexterity. There are a few cases where this is muddied a bit. Cases where your critical hit rate (your Dexterity compared to the enemies Agility) is very low, you can benefit from added Dexterity. Though surprise of surprises, there is also cap to that Dexterity-Agility comparison. As well as incredibly low accuracy situations where the 7 acc from Byakko's Haidate may in fact help you.

    Unfortunately you're not going to find an all encompassing rule in regards to gearing for Blade: Jin. You could dissect each mobs stats vs. your own and come up with a good idea. That is a lot of work, and removes a lot of enjoyment from many players. The best bet is to aim for gearing for both stats, but lean towards Strength, unless your Dexterity value far outweighs the Strength value on a piece of equipment.

    My suggestions:
    Head: Aias Bonnet
    Neck: Breeze Gorget
    Body: Iga Ningi +1
    Waist: Anguinus Belt
    Rings: Rajas + Strength Ring(If Epona's is out of your reach)
    Hands: Ninja Tekko +1
    Legs: Byakko's Haidate/Usukane Hizayoroi
    Feet: Iga Kyahan +1 (or 2)

    To answer Nattack, the WS gorgets will always help but I assume you wonder at what point does stacking a stat defeat it. First you have to not need the accuracy inherent in the WS Gorget. Second the stat you add has to be worth more than the addition of the .1 to total FTP (as a comparison).

    If your WS's total FTP is 2.0, and your gorget adds .1, you've increased your ftp by 2.1(the total with gorget) divided by 2 (your total without) equals 5%.

    Whereas you equip a neckpiece with Stat +5, and your WS Mod for that stat is 30%. Your bonus to the base damage value would come down to 5 multiplied by 30% multiplied by the alpha value (inherent in every WS Mod calculation) of .85. This means your Stat +5 is worth 1.275 (5*.85*.3). 1.275 doesn't seem like much does it. If your previous WS Mod value was 40, adding 1.275 is going to increase it by:

    41.275 / 40 = 1.03 (or 3%).

    At first glance your going to say, well heck yes the gorget wins. It comes down to weather or not the accuracy on the gorget is going to cap your accuracy out, as well as if the Stat doesn't carry any extra bonuses like STR to attack.

    So compare the INCREASES to each other. The damage formula is all multiplicative, so the biggest changes to each portion is going to win out. You increase one portion by 5% (the gorget) and compare it to the stat increase portion of 3% and you can see the 5% is going to multiply into something bigger. Better damage!
    (0)
    Last edited by Faule; 03-16-2011 at 03:53 PM. Reason: Grammar
    Faule -- Quetz
    Langly -- Ninja land (it's a place don't look at me like that)

  7. #17
    Player Greatguardian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    3,238
    Quote Originally Posted by Een View Post
    There isn't a priority over one another as far as STR and DEX. They are BOTH 30% multipliers.

    But if you wanted to put one over the other, DEX > STR since Jin is a Critical hit rate WS, Dex is what decides your Critical hit rate, ACC, AND its a 30% multiplier.

    And, if you wanted to prioritize them in order its Katana skill>Critical Hit rate>STR&DEX are equals@30%modifiers > Attack is last really...

    Merit that Katana skill, make sure it's capped, cap critical hit rate and cap both str and dex in merits equally...the multipliers make them equal. I've broke 2500..do it pretty constantly with only a few pieces of IGA+2 gear and then the remainder of other gear. Especially in Abyssea I break 2500.

    At 75 in a burn pt before Abyssea, I did 2123 Blade: Jin with my old school set up. Basically everything listed below if you take the Iga out of the list. Max Katana, Critical Hit rate, Fudo off hand

    Main: Senji Offhand: Kamome
    Head: Optical Hat forever, just for the ACC, but there are other helms out now...Iga+1 and Iga+2 is best tho.
    Body: Kirin's Osode til IGA+
    Hands: Ochimusha Kote til IGA+
    Legs: Byakko's Haidate til IGA+
    Feet: Rutter Sabatons or if your Hume, level 60 RSE feet. til IGA+
    Waist: Warwolf Belt
    Neck: Chivalrous chain is acceptable, helps with ACC (Gave up on the WS gorget, doesn't seem to really help anymore.) But for max damage, and this is MY opinion, use the Katana Skill Gorget.
    Back:Cuchulain's Mantle if you can afford it, Cerb mantle is good enough, or Commander's +3 str dex agi
    Rings: I use 1 Flame and 1 Breeze or whatever gives +5 dex, I forget. Plan to get +7 rings when prices lower. 1 STR 1 DEX
    Earrings: I do have 2 +2 Dex earrings but I was able to afford it back in the day because of my Smithing skill..was able to make some HQ gear for a 100+3 GS'er...not recommended to go broke over tho. Minuet earring and whatever else is suitable for WS macro.

    I have max Katana Skill, I'd suggest the katana skill gorget over the WS dmg Gorget anyday IMO. I think those WS gorgets are broke now.
    No to be insensitive, but take most of the above post with a grain of salt. That is far from an ideal Jin set, and I believe the priorities are off as well. If you want something fairly easily obtainable, the following should suffice:

    Main: Hochomasamune (Oirandori is also fine)
    Sub: Kamome
    Ammo: Qirmiz Tathlum
    Head: Aias Bonnet is ideal here, Varangian Helm and Iga+2 are okay if you don't have it and Varangian is not hard to get
    Neck: Gorget. Gorget. Gorget.
    Ears: Brutal Earring, first and foremost. Either a +6/7 Attack or +2/3 Str earring work in the second slot.
    Body: Iga+2 is ideal, but Loki's Kaftan is an easy second and destroys other pieces
    Hands: Heafoc Mitts
    Rings: Rajas, Rajas, Rajas. Second slot: Epona's if you have it, Flame or other STR ring if you don't
    Back: Atheling Mantle. Cavaros is decent but *useless if you are using Loki's as you will be capped on Crit damage already*
    Waist: Elemental Belt, Warwolf, or Anguinus is roughly that order
    Legs: Byakko's Haidate is a solid piece here
    Feet: Rutter Sabatons are also fine until Iga+1/2

    When you are in Abyssea, using Razed Ruins, *Adding Additional DEX Will Not Affect Your Critical Hit Rate*, because your dDex is already capped on just about everything from RR and Cruor buffs. That's important to know, and why a lot of these pieces (such as Heafoc Mitts) are ideal despite having no Dex or even -Dex.
    (0)
    Last edited by Greatguardian; 03-16-2011 at 03:55 PM.

  8. #18
    Player Faule's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    62
    Character
    Langly
    World
    Quetzalcoatl
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    Good point on Verangian Helm and Haefoc Mitts, completely forgot about it. Between it and Aias you have two helmets for any conditions you could run into. Low accuracy/high accuracy/high fSTR/low pDIF.
    (0)
    Faule -- Quetz
    Langly -- Ninja land (it's a place don't look at me like that)

  9. #19
    Player Nattack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    145
    Character
    Nattack
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    DRK Lv 99
    I dont know about Heafoc mitts, they seem like an even worse Alkyoneus's bracers in disguise.
    (0)
    You can't even hold it.

  10. #20
    Player Faule's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    62
    Character
    Langly
    World
    Quetzalcoatl
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    Remember the cap on the difference between your Dexterity and the Enemies Agility is 50. With Atma of the Razed Ruin, and Cruor buffs what they are these days. Dex-4 and Accuracy -8 means nothing. The accuracy you gain from all the Dexterity in the two aforementioned buffs largely counter the negatives on those gloves.

    Example: Cruor Buffs + the Atma can net you upwards of easily 70 DEX extra. Which is also 35 extra accuracy out of nowhere. -4 and -8 aren't that big of a deal.
    (0)
    Faule -- Quetz
    Langly -- Ninja land (it's a place don't look at me like that)

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