New enhancing spell for RDM to promote party support.

[saevel]

Only if you suck and don't have AF3 and Composure for like triple duration on others. And god forbid RDM has something useful to cast rather than just sit there doing nothing, recasting Dia III every few minutes and nothing else. Haste already lasts like 12-15 minutes on other people with the right gear and we have so much haste and fastcast gear available that you can do a whole buff cycle on a single party in less than 1 minute and not have to recast it for another 15.

Umm triple duration?

+30% from gear and another +50% from composure for 1.50 * 1.30 = 1.95 or 95% duration bonus. 195% duration is less then 300% duration by a fairly large margin. Hyperbole doesn't help your case.

Now to the real problem with using duration bonus, all except the feet and head are replaced by +enh skill items. Body / Legs / Hands are all +15 (hands +18) for a total of 48 skill. Thus for max potency (500 skill) your looking at cape + boots for 30% and another +10% from two emp items. 1.30 * 1.10 = 1.43 or a 43% duration bonus.

For cycling haste your talking three to four (only on melees) haste's per 5:51 seconds, that isn't bad at all and represents a reasonable load from the 75 days. The problem is when you add on ~more~ stuff to the top of those hastes, spells that you won't be using full duration on. Temper is 3min and +1% per 10 skill, Gain-STR is also 3min and +1 per 20 skill. That means 4:17 duration on both Gain-STR and Temper if cast on another party member. Now your casting load is six to eight spells per 4:17 and another three to four per 5:51 seconds. Temper has a long recast, as does Haste. Gain-STR has a relatively short recast but it almost as long as haste for cast time.

Congrats you just turned RDM into a buff monkey doing nearly twice as much cycling as it did at 75.

None of this is an issue when self-cast due to the 3.9x duration bonus making all three of those an 11:42 duration buff along with Enspell.

It would be like a BRD casting marchs individually on each party member.

Now take your foot out of your mouth Oph.

[saevel]

If he could give me +25 STR, +20% DA, and more potent Cure 3/4s, my mule would come RDM a lot more often and would be a lot more useful when he came. I have to imagine this would be the case in any old-content event, where you're typically would take increased killspeed over WHM's defensive advantages/Cure V+VI/etc.

There is a reason it's your mule and not an actual player. Boring and mind numbing doesn't even begin to describe cycles, not to mention the sheer amount of abuse you receive from other players.

More Single-Target spells to cycle is something asked for by people who don't actually intend to play RDM as a main job. It sounds great until it becomes your responsibility to hit the same four macros over and over again for 1~3 hours with small breaks in between sets. BRD's can at least watch TV or do other things in between their songs, RDM's have to keep pressing the buttons and staring at a timer slowly going down till they hit the next button. Cycles are single handily responsible for burning out all your old school RDM's, it becomes so mind numbing that you simply cease to enjoy it and it turns into a job and not entertainment. Over a period of several months to several years the player will move on to another job that offers more interactive entertainment. I moved to SAM / WAR / BLU and eventually PLD / DRK to get away from the cycles of RDM.

Simplest solution would be to remove Gain-XXX from the game and replace them with Boost-STR for both RDM and WHM.

You won't ever get Temper in its current form, SE set it aside as a melee buff for RDM not everyone else. SE would nerf the living hell out of it before they'd let the RDM give other people that much +DA. COR's at least have to sacrifice a roll and have it semi-random to do that, RDM's would stack with everything else in the game.

[Duelle]

Congrats you just turned RDM into a buff monkey doing nearly twice as much cycling as it did at 75.

Seconded. We'd be taking steps backwards instead of forwards.

Red Mage would be relevant again as a healer for old content/meleeburns!

Or we could just fix RDM's native enhancing magic and let them target other players.

In other words, more of the same crap we've had for years instead of something new. Not interested.

[Neisan_Quetz]

ITT: I'd rather be useless at everything than useful at something.

Boring and mind numbing is how many of the playerbase feels about Whm, that doesn't change its usefulness.

[saevel]

ITT: I'd rather be useless at everything than useful at something.

Except it's not useless at everything, it's just not the best at anything.

BIG difference between those two concepts.

And even then, should RDM be able to target it's unique buffs, BRD and COR would still be better enhances, so even then RDM would still be not the best.

Thus your logic means you'd take a RDM who was not the best at buffing, but not take a RDM who was not the best in any other category? Seems to be rather self serving logic, especially as you won't be the RDM forced into the cycles and being yelled at should something overly bad happen.

[Neisan_Quetz]

If you can't warrant bringing the job, then yes it is pretty useless.

Rdm shouldn't be a better enhancer than brd and cor, but it should be better than having the actual useful buffs self target. Emp+2 was a step in the right direction, but there is no reason why buffs can't have longer base durations and be single target castable.

[saevel]

If you can't warrant bringing the job, then yes it is pretty useless.

Rdm shouldn't be a better enhancer than brd and cor, but it should be better than having the actual useful buffs self target. Emp+2 was a step in the right direction, but there is no reason why buffs can't have longer base durations and be single target castable.

So you'd be willing to take subpar enhancer but not subpar at anything else?

And yes there is a big reason, because SE says so. Temper is a RDM melee buff plain and simple, whatever you think about RDM's melee component, Temper is for that specifically. I would prefer Temper to be accessionable similar to how Phalanx works, but SE shot that idea down cold.

Gain-Stat buffs are the RDM version of WHM's party buffs. We already have a precedent for them, the Barelement spells. Each one is a different element, MP cost is the same between RDM and WHM, WHM get's aoe while RDM gets self-target. Seeing as SE already has a party castable version, they won't be making RDM's target-able anytime soon. Barelement spells are still self only (Accession works). Again I asked for this to be made Accessionable and SE said hell no. If SE won't allow them to be accessionable then why would they allow them to be single targetable? Both would have the exact same result just one method is more painful and mind numbing then the other.

There are things SE needs to do to fix the job, they already announced their going to attempt to fix enfeebles. Why on earth would you want to reply the hell that was 75 cycle whore? Better to not play it at all then to play that again, this sentiment isn't just me but the moan of thousands of my predecessors.

And ultimately, SE themselves said what they planned on RDM becoming. It had absolutely nothing to do with buffing party members and everything to do with buffing themselves and debuffing the target monster. At least if you can get the JP statement translated.

[saevel]

The funny thing is your about to make a comment about RDM's "single target-able buffs" stacking with BRD and COR and that somehow makes them more useful. Yet RDM's nukes while inferior to BLM do stack with BLM's. RDM's melee while inferior to WAR / SAM / ect.. does stack with them.

I would go so far as to say RDM's nuking / meleeing stacks better with BLM / DD's then their buffs do with COR / BRD. 25 extra STR and 20% extra DA is nothing compared to what those other two can do. Its not even half what double march's can do nor what DRK / WAR / SAM or Misers (until recent nerfage) can do.

[Neisan_Quetz]

The heck, must have forgot to hit reply.

Nice argument their chief, because Brd can't also melee if they wanted to... That isn't somehow unique to Rdm.
25 str and 20% DA on Rdm just stops it from being the worst melee job after Blm and Smn.


'Because SE says so' does not make their remark absolute. Single target would make Temper actually useful for situations you would want to bring a Rdm. Right now you could skip the spell and it wouldn't make a lick of difference to the job's situation or its usefulness in many situations. And if you haven't realized Libri parties are a thing of the past so no 2007 isn't going to repeat itself. Refresh isn't a necessity and cycles don't really exist to the extent of having to haste 3-4 DD and having it wear 3mins later per cast refresh self and/or another mage etc. Heaven forbid the Rdm have to cast spells to help its allies.

[saevel]

The heck, must have forgot to hit reply.

Nice argument their chief, because Brd can't also melee if they wanted to... That isn't somehow unique to Rdm.
25 str and 20% DA on Rdm just stops it from being the worst melee job after Blm and Smn.


'Because SE says so' does not make their remark absolute. Single target would make Temper actually useful for situations you would want to bring a Rdm. Right now you could skip the spell and it wouldn't make a lick of difference to the job's situation or its usefulness in many situations. And if you haven't realized Libri parties are a thing of the past so no 2007 isn't going to repeat itself. Refresh isn't a necessity and cycles don't really exist to the extent of having to haste 3-4 DD and having it wear 3mins later per cast refresh self and/or another mage etc. Heaven forbid the Rdm have to cast spells to help its allies.

Actually BRD's can if they want, just more chose not to, they were a huge discussion about it a few years back. Four songs leave's enough time to melee for whatever that's worth. Anyhow that's irrevelent because your talking about RDM/SCH doing main healing + cycling on 3~4 meles with a BRD in a DD pt. I know it, you know it, lets not pretend otherwise. You are talking ~exactly~ what RDM used to do in 2007, verbatim. Your "usefulness" is just Haste + Temper + Gain-STR + Cure IV, which is actually more cycles then Haste + Cure IV.

At least Byrth had the integrity to say exactly why he wanted RDM to have those buffs, so his mule could buff him more.

The whole melee job reference is lol, now I remember why I had you on ignore.