[dev1080] Thief - Assassin's Charge/feint proposed Adjustments

[Karbuncle]

For those who didn't read

Assassin's Charge Merits are giving a 25% Bonus to Accuracy with Each Merit (Total of +100% Acc)

Feint Is giving ~25% higher Chance to upgrade TH (total of +100% Chance)

That said, Lets discuss!:

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Assassin's Charge Change?
Useless!. Sorry if that comes off harsh . Assassin's Charge is 99% of the time stacked with Sneak Attack, or Trick Attack, to provide best results. Accuracy bonus would be 100% Worthless (Since, SA/TA Guarantees all hits are successful on the first round of Main hand/Offhand Swings) . Could we please re-evaluate this? Perhaps:

"Increases Triple Attack Damage From Assassin's Charge by 5% Per Merit, Total 20%". (Would be a weaker version of Overwhelm, Still limited by Direction (SA) or Restricted by Person (TA))
**Alternatively, If thats too powerful, 2.5% Per Merit, Total 10%.
**Alternatively, If that too is too powerful, a simple "increases Attack by 25%" Would be more beneficial. Accuracy is just... Useless for it is what i'm getting at :X

Please Consider it ^^;

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Feint's Change?
I don't want to talk about it. Treasure Hunter is a touchy Subject for THF, Suffice to say, I'm going with 5/5 Feint merits, 1/5 Assassin's Charge, 4/5 Aura Steal.

Only reason i'm staying with 5/5 Feint is because Ambush is still Garbage due to its directional restrictions.

Your Opinions, Views? I know some Thieves out there want to talk about it.

How will this effect your current merit set up?

[Vold]

Looks like I'll be redoing feint. I never did do the zerg thing to put it to use so I switched it for aura steal... now it's going to be useful, I guess. I am a treasure hunter at heart so I'm always game for more TH.

I suppose I'll do 5/5 feint, 1/5 AC and 4/5 aura steal. It just makes the most sense even though aura is about as useful as ambush for me.

[Babekeke]

I'm currently 5/5 feint, 5/5 aura steal.

Where you say assassin's charge update is useless, I disagree. It's brilliant that the merits 2-5 are useless, because it means that it requires only 1 merit without gimping ourselves XD

I was sort of torn between which to drop a merit for to obtain AC though. I <3 a 100% dispel for the few mobs that use something worth stealing (def boost/eva boost/att boost... even shell if solo vs casting mobs) but.... a 100% chance to increase TH every 2 minutes? I'd be stupid to pass that up I think. TH on long fights should always be well into the double-figures now, and I might even see some of these mythic TH15s that I've heard about.

So yeah, 5/5 Feint, 4/5 Aura Steal, 1/5 Assassin's Charge. Same as every other thief on this game I imagine.

[Karbuncle]

Where you say assassin's charge update is useless, I disagree. It's brilliant that the merits 2-5 are useless, because it means that it requires only 1 merit without gimping ourselves XD

I love our optimism, Thats actually a good point ^^

Edit: Also, Its not 100% Chance to upgrade TH, Its "+100%" Chance. Meaning, If your upgrade rate is 5%, with Feint, It will be 10%.

it just doubles the current TH upgrade rate from how i read it.

[Motenten]

I love our optimism, Thats actually a good point ^^

Edit: Also, Its not 100% Chance to upgrade TH, Its "+100%" Chance. Meaning, If your upgrade rate is 5%, with Feint, It will be 10%.

it just doubles the current TH upgrade rate from how i read it.

That doesn't really make sense. From a few minor parses I have, the chance of TH leveling up from just normal melee hits is about 1%. Since Feint generally isn't stacked with SA/TA, that would be the baseline figure you'd most likely to apply it to, and saying it has a fractional chance (1.25%, 1.5%, 1.75%) of leveling up with 2/3/4 merits just sounds silly (most percentages in the game only work in whole unit increments, so you could either have 1% or 2%, but not 1.5%).

In addition, while there's already been a typo or two in the translations, it doesn't say anything about "+100%", it just says "by 25% per point". Fun with interpreting percentages, I guess.

[Karbuncle]

Feint lasts about 45 seconds, If it was 100% Chance to upgrade TH for 45 seconds, You could hit TH80 in that time frame with just a single THF <_>

I guess it could technically be "100%" with just feint on (I.E upgrades when Feint Lands)... But still, on a 3 minute timer, With multiple Thieves, You could drive TH up to insane amounts in a short period of time.

[Motenten]

Feint lasts about 45 seconds, If it was 100% Chance to upgrade TH for 45 seconds, You could hit TH80 in that time frame with just a single THF <_>

I guess it could technically be "100%" with just feint on (I.E upgrades when Feint Lands)... But still, on a 3 minute timer, With multiple Thieves, You could drive TH up to insane amounts in a short period of time.

Ah, you were interpreting it to mean an increased chance for TH to level up while a mob has Feint applied to it? I was expecting it to be the chance for TH to level up on the hit that applied Feint (sort of like the increased chance to level up TH on the hit that gets the SA or TA bonus).

And yes, on a two minute timer, it has the potential to be taken really high with multiple thfs. A single thf would have 4 SATA chances plus one (potentially) guaranteed Feint chance, plus normal hits, every 2 minutes. A 10 minute fight would give... 100% * 5 Feint = 5, 5% * 20 SATA = 1, and say 1% * 200 normal = 2, total of +8 TH on top of 6 or 7 base, potentially TH 15. Well, there's probably a cap on it somewhere so multiple thfs can't skyrocket the value.

[FrankReynolds]

I read it as a 100% chance to proc every 2 minutes, but SE is an evil genie. They will probably come squash that hope.

I was really hoping that they would boost the actual effects of treasure hunter, instead of just making the silly number go higher. Treasure hunter level 1,000,006 still doesn't mean crap if the drop rate is only increased by .00001% for every 100 levels.

I've always had feint capped because it comes in handy for things that have high eva, merit parties where half the DDs don't have capped skills, low man stuff where I am trying to land steps, and the fact that I almost never have a need for aura steal.

[Nerathun]

Your Opinions, Views?

We got screwed again...

Unique abilities that bring THF into big fight ? And I insist on the unique trait. Right now we are simply looking at ours giving away to others.

Define a role where THF can be usefull again would be nice.

- Damage : Other DDs are better for that since the very beginning.
- Tank : Other jobs have real tool for that. We don't.
- Hate management : Say hello to DRG
- Drop rate increase : TH will be something common soon and well TH2 vs THx who cares...

Leaves out, why playing THF now ? Why like a job that is screwed so often ? I'm already masochist for playing this game for so long and I won't /ragequit for that but still. I hate this kind of [Dev Track]

[Jile]

I'd love it if the Dev's would Fix TH so it works better (or at least a notable difference in drop
rate with stacked TH effect so there's a point to stacking TH) rather than gimp other jobs as
a "fix" to TH being broken or adding gimmicks to increase stacked TH.

As it stands, I don't believe there is a notable difference between drops from TH7 and
(exaggerating a little) TH100 and SE should address this issue before making changes
that allow easier/quicker TH effect when at the moment stacked TH doesn't appear to
impact drops.

The only thing that makes sense is "if" TH (effect) is working as intended, SE must have
also changed mob's treasure pooling so higher TH made much less of a difference than
it used to. Going back a few years a relic hand THF vs a non relic THF had a substantial,
real, noticeable difference in overall drops vs someone without.