[dev1042] Paladin spells

[Alhanelem]

I'd always assumed that the reason PLD doesn't get the highest tier of shell in the first place is simply because it would be a higher level than the level cap due to shells being learned at later levels than protects (PLD had pro IV and shell III at 75, now it has pro V and shell IV at 99).

[Neisan_Quetz]

I dont care one way or the other. you said pld doesnt need shell 5, i simply stated a fact about holy2

And you got an answer about Shell V already, get over it.

[camaroz]

And you got an answer about Shell V already, get over it.

last word.jpg

[Unleashhell]

Personally I don't see why PLD needs Shell V even at 99. Granted yes I have Aegis but even if I didn't Shell IV is just fine. Giving Holy II is just a waste imo. The amount of MP that it will need is prolly 1/3 of most PLD MP pool and its not going to be worth using. They should have given Flash II instead.

[Economizer]

Giving Holy II is just a waste imo.

Spell list completion, and the spell was already in the dats even before they gave it to White Mage. If anything, it was a waste to give it to White Mage, because that was the real effort - giving it to Paladin is just a simple toggle of jobs able to use a spell.

Holy II has twice the potency of Holy for only 50 more MP. Which is to say, Holy II completely sucks unless you use a full Solace charge or Divine Emblem, in which case it only mostly sucks.

[Clou777]

i think Protectra V and Shellra V should be scroll items and WHM merits should be changed to Protectra VI and Shellra VI as it makes no sence that other jobs can have WHM meritted spells pretty much

[LeaderofAtlantis]

I'm still confused by the fact that enemies can use spells as PLDs that we can't even if we hit the same level. I mean, the same could be said about NIN and it's inability to learn some Ni level spells, but take the Banish spells - isn't PLD the anti-undead job? I know most people here wouldn't care either way about them, but I'm just curious about the logic behind us not getting them but we get Holy II. How about Raise II?

I guess I'm just mainly wondering about the thought process behind giving jobs certain spells and not giving it to them when a beastman, for example, of the same level can use spells that we don't have access to.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

i think Protectra V and Shellra V should be scroll items and WHM merits should be changed to Protectra VI and Shellra VI as it makes no sence that other jobs can have WHM meritted spells pretty much

Not at 75 they couldn't, and still can't. Shell V and Protect V are only equal to tier one, and is single target. That's like comparing a SCH Accessioning Phalanx with Phalanx II.

Personally, if they do change it then it should be plain old "Protect Effect and Shell Effect" not another tier.

I'm still confused by the fact that enemies can use spells as PLDs that we can't even if we hit the same level. I mean, the same could be said about NIN and it's inability to learn some Ni level spells, but take the Banish spells - isn't PLD the anti-undead job? I know most people here wouldn't care either way about them, but I'm just curious about the logic behind us not getting them but we get Holy II. How about Raise II?

I guess I'm just mainly wondering about the thought process behind giving jobs certain spells and not giving it to them when a beastman, for example, of the same level can use spells that we don't have access to.

This is true of most jobs. RDM enemies can cast more than 15 different spells at much lower levels than RDM can even get at 99. A few examples:

Diaga II - Lowers defense of enemies within area of effect and gradually deals light elemental damage.
MP Cost: 60 Casting Time: 1.75 Recast Delay: 6.25
Target: Enemy / Type: White / Element: Light / Skill: Enfeebling Magic
Jobs: WHM52 RDM45

Diaga III - Lowers defense of enemies within area of effect and gradually deals light elemental damage.
MP Cost: 120 Casting Time: 2.0 Recast Delay: 6.5
Target: Enemy / Type: White / Element: Light / Skill: Enfeebling Magic
Jobs: RDM75

Meteor II - Magic Help Message.
MP Cost: 150 Casting Time: 18.0 Recast Delay: 52.0
Target: Enemy / Type: Black / Element: Light / Skill: Elemental Magic
Jobs: WHM75 BLM75 RDM75

Paralyga - Magic Help Message.
MP Cost: 12 Casting Time: 4.0 Recast Delay: 20.0
Target: Enemy / Type: White / Element: Ice / Skill: Enfeebling Magic
Jobs: WHM61 RDM61

Slowga - Magic Help Message.
MP Cost: 30 Casting Time: 2.5 Recast Delay: 30.0
Target: Enemy / Type: White / Element: Earth / Skill: Enfeebling Magic
Jobs: WHM61 RDM61

Hastega - Magic Help Message.
MP Cost: 80 Casting Time: 4.0 Recast Delay: 30.0
Target: Self Only / Type: White / Element: Wind / Skill: Enhancing Magic
Jobs: WHM61 RDM61

It's just the stupid way SE works.

[Ophannus]

RDM should totally have AoE enfeebles. Why does WHM get AoE cures and enhancing and BLM gets AoE nukes but RDM gets nothing aoe except diaga. Worthless.

[Theytak]

Not at 75 they couldn't, and still can't. Shell V and Protect V are only equal to tier one, and is single target. That's like comparing a SCH Accessioning Phalanx with Phalanx II.

Personally, if they do change it then it should be plain old "Protect Effect and Shell Effect" not another tier.

but... Phalanx is stronger than Phalanx II with 5 merits... or it was back at 75, the last time any rdm I knew had any phalanx II merits at all... or did I miss the point entirely?