Sept update blues

[Greatguardian]

Is it that surprising that they emphasized Endgame content with this update? Endgame players are the ones who have finished Abyssea. They're the ones who need something to do. Most casual players don't even have a full set of AF3+2, let alone even a single Empyrean. There is still plenty of content for them to do. And even then, WoE, Dynamis, and HKCNM are all Casual-friendly events.

[Yugl]

I'm seeing niche pieces for a handful of jobs, no major upgrades besides some of the VW bodies/hats. Mostly Inventory -1, mostly things you will seldom use.

This is just a semantics argument. In other word, "My definition of non-niche and handful is different from yours." You don't have a real comeback other than that.

Better? Yes. But better in the sense of level progression that we've seen through out the rest of the game? No. Even if it is just 5 levels, you mentioned Hoard Ring Vs. the new Attack/STP ring. Yes it's better, but off the top of my head I can't think of one job that will benefit from it in the ideal set. WAR? 5hit will still require tactical mantle, so put your Blitz ring back on. SAM? 5hit requires haste sacrifices and you can 6hit w/ sword strap reliably, so go get a mars ring. DRK? Maybe for a Apocalypse build, but I don't get into that. Good if you're trying to push for a Cala 6hit, but you're still using tactical mantle and accuracy sacrifices so there's no way it'll be worth it.

DRG working on a 5-hit without access to Rose strap will require it. Alternative options, insofar as that's not all that's implemented, is not always bad.

Even 80 brought in things like Loki's Kaftan, 6% haste panties, and AF3 accessories.

Loki's was less phenomenal then than it is now because we didn't have CDC, CW, Blade Hi, Razed Ruins, and so forth. Some AF3 were crap. Just look at Mavi scarf. Your list here is less than what the 95 piece brought and some of these were more niche than the level 95 update. It's illogical for you to assert that level 80 brought a bold upgrade in gear which maintaining that this update did not.

Should everything in the update be far superior to previous gear? Maybe, maybe not. Should it show clear signs of level progression to make the average player want to spend 13$ a month? Yes.

You're really just creating a contradiction for yourself or trying to make vague arguments here. If the gains from level 80 were sufficient, then 95 should be sufficient. If you want to spell out exactly what stats they need to make so that it hits that oh-so vague notion of "not far superior" yet has "clear signs of level progression", then feel free to flesh that out. Otherwise, it's linguistic craft that spells out "I'm not satisfied" without giving clear justification.

Overall, I think the another issue you fail to recognize, aside from the fact that we paid an extra $10 for Abyssea content, is that the player's gripe over this entire situation is due to casuals crying about Abyssea and other people attaining the same "far superior" gear you mentioned are to blame. This is the problem when casual players try to act elitist. Elitists can handle difficult content with grand rewards because they're in it for the haul. Casuals making elitist demands are difficult to appease because they want gear that is easy to obtain, yet they want separation from some imaginary "herd" they feel superior to (Preposition...). At the same time, if it's gear they cannot obtain, they don't want it being vastly superior because they're worried about the real elites towering over them. It should be obvious how SE tried to reconcile these tugs and how the current situation resulted from that. Case and point, the current dilemma is the fault of ideas originating from players, not SE.

Edit: And I make all these statements knowing that I'm currently excluded from VW content. Despite being a poster on BG, I'm more casual than people expect.

[Septimus]

I think that the truly disappointing part of this update is the lack of story. The CoP days may have been the dark ages when it came to convenience, playability, and not being hated by the development team, but the story involved with the game was incredibly rich. Updates could have up to a dozen quests added, many with more story involved than just "fetch me these items" for our standard monthly fee. To get a dozen of anything now you have to pay $10, and chances are the stories will be sloppily thrown together like those first three terrible add-ons. (Seriously, I will never forgive whoever did the "no one remembers anything because they were dreaming" garbage from a Crystaline Prophecy. Any Freshman literature undergrad could have scribbled out a better story than that.)

Take Open Sesame for example. This was a standard fetch quest where you just give the NPC some stuff and that is it. Instead, it could have been about an archeologist who wanted to study the Quicksand Caves ruins. Throw in a brief tour of the place through ??? spots, discuss the history of the place, maybe tell us some things that we never knew about it, the archeologist figures out how to make a gizmo to work the doors and gives us one because we were so helpful to him; everyone would feel a little more enriched for the experience. Instead we got a very lazy "get me this and something else" and called it a day.

Sure, some people don't care about the game's backstory, but a lot of us do. The game's lore keeps us connected to Vana'diel, it helps us to care about the game- anymore I am finding this part to be disturbingly wanting.

[Helel]

You can't really blame them... it takes a lot of time to develop add-ons like abyssea. I know they recycled the maps and such, but it's still a lot of work with npc/mob placement, quests, proc system, on and on. I assume they'll add some more mini-expansions for the 99 cap, but we'll see.

I enjoy VW quite a bit now, but it's still not the same as abyssea. It would be nice to see them incorporate new battlefields, instead of recycling old NMs.

[Return1]

People will whine about anything.

This update was awesome. It brought back WoE from the brink of death, it added BCNMs with rewards that are actually worth doing them for, expanded VW which is awesome even if the drops are rare, added new EXP camps/mobs, and they streamlined existing EXP even further with repeating pages.

On top of this, we got awesome new spells, some of you got awesome JAs, and lots of gear upgrades.

You want some examples of awesome gear upgrades? Is 10 right off the top of my head good enough?

Hagneia stone
Tyrant's Ring
Prolix Ring
Fajin Boots
Earthcry Earring
Nefer Kalasiris
Oretenia's Cape
Glassblower's Belt
Mekira
Phasmida Belt

All are pretty legit upgrades for their purposes.

[Taint2]

Is it that surprising that they emphasized Endgame content with this update? Endgame players are the ones who have finished Abyssea. They're the ones who need something to do. Most casual players don't even have a full set of AF3+2, let alone even a single Empyrean. There is still plenty of content for them to do. And even then, WoE, Dynamis, and HKCNM are all Casual-friendly events.

Pretty much this.

[Leonlionheart]

This is just a semantics argument. In other word, "My definition of non-niche and handful is different from yours." You don't have a real comeback other than that.

DRG working on a 5-hit without access to Rose strap will require it. Alternative options, insofar as that's not all that's implemented, is not always bad.

Loki's was less phenomenal then than it is now because we didn't have CDC, CW, Blade Hi, Razed Ruins, and so forth. Some AF3 were crap. Just look at Mavi scarf. Your list here is less than what the 95 piece brought and some of these were more niche than the level 95 update. It's illogical for you to assert that level 80 brought a bold upgrade in gear which maintaining that this update did not.

You're really just creating a contradiction for yourself or trying to make vague arguments here. If the gains from level 80 were sufficient, then 95 should be sufficient. If you want to spell out exactly what stats they need to make so that it hits that oh-so vague notion of "not far superior" yet has "clear signs of level progression", then feel free to flesh that out. Otherwise, it's linguistic craft that spells out "I'm not satisfied" without giving clear justification.

Overall, I think the another issue you fail to recognize, aside from the fact that we paid an extra $10 for Abyssea content, is that the player's gripe over this entire situation is due to casuals crying about Abyssea and other people attaining the same "far superior" gear you mentioned are to blame. This is the problem when casual players try to act elitist. Elitists can handle difficult content with grand rewards because they're in it for the haul. Casuals making elitist demands are difficult to appease because they want gear that is easy to obtain, yet they want separation from some imaginary "herd" they feel superior to (Preposition...). At the same time, if it's gear they cannot obtain, they don't want it being vastly superior because they're worried about the real elites towering over them. It should be obvious how SE tried to reconcile these tugs and how the current situation resulted from that. Case and point, the current dilemma is the fault of ideas originating from players, not SE.

Edit: And I make all these statements knowing that I'm currently excluded from VW content. Despite being a poster on BG, I'm more casual than people expect.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

[Zarchery]

Did you ever notice that every update ever, since the inception of this game, is filled with "SE MADE A TERRIBLE UPDATE!" Every single one of them.

I'm not saying that everyone hates the game, just that people who are dissatisfied will complain whereas satisfied people will just stay quiet and enjoy what is provided.

[Neonii]

I'm seeing niche pieces for a handful of jobs, no major upgrades besides some of the VW bodies/hats. Mostly Inventory -1, mostly things you will seldom use.

Better? Yes. But better in the sense of level progression that we've seen through out the rest of the game? No. Even if it is just 5 levels, you mentioned Hoard Ring Vs. the new Attack/STP ring. Yes it's better, but off the top of my head I can't think of one job that will benefit from it in the ideal set. WAR? 5hit will still require tactical mantle, so put your Blitz ring back on. SAM? 5hit requires haste sacrifices and you can 6hit w/ sword strap reliably, so go get a mars ring. DRK? Maybe for a Apocalypse build, but I don't get into that. Good if you're trying to push for a Cala 6hit, but you're still using tactical mantle and accuracy sacrifices so there's no way it'll be worth it.

85 and 90 content both brought in clearly superior pieces to anything we've seen before. Even 80 brought in things like Loki's Kaftan, 6% haste panties, and AF3 accessories.

Should everything in the update be far superior to previous gear? Maybe, maybe not. Should it show clear signs of level progression to make the average player want to spend 13$ a month? Yes.

Point is, this stuff isn't something that the average player is going to go gaga over like AF3+2. It's not as big of a jump, and it's harder. This isn't a good business model.

One mans trash is another mans treasure and imo leave it at that.

[Washburn]

I was really hoping to see the new merits on this update. I suspect another mini-update will probably come in november/december. But, who knows. Either way, the update we just got definetly wont hold me over til the 99 update.