SE, Temper Activation Rate

[Supersun]

What's the duration of Temper? At just 5% Double Attack, it very seems possible to actually lose attack rounds by taking the time to cast such a spell.

Same as the other 90% of Rdm's enhancing spells.

[SpankWustler]

Figuring in Composure's bonus to the duration, at 5% the spell easily remains worth casting even at capped delay reduction. I didn't take double attack from other sources or equipment that lengthens spell durations into account, but since the result is just "yes" or "no" and the spell sucks either way, I figure that's not too important.

[saevel]

Well with composure, AF+2 boots and cape we're talking the same duration as haste.
180 * 1.3 * 3.0 = 702 seconds or 11:42. Even at 5% you'd still gain attack rounds, especially if setup a macro that applied your combat related buffs at once.

/ma Phalanx <me> <wait 6> (can't remember exact wait I used)
/ma Gain-STR <me> <wait 7>
/ma Temper <me>
<Insert any other needed buffs here>

I do this whenever an opertunity presents itself, either before / after a fight or during a natural pause in the combat. Contrary to what some of the DD's would have people believe, we don't fight brick wall's with infinite HP for loot.

[Tashan]

But does Temper stack with equipment/job traits?

If so, I cannot see a problem with 5% rate.

DA Khanda +2 = 10%
Atheling Mantle = +3%
Brutal Earring = +5%
Calmecac Trousers = +3%

RDM already has 20% in respectable equipment DA.

Potentially 30% if one opts to /WAR for the job trait (arguably not).

With DA Khanda +2 being upgradable in the next update for more DA, Temper's 5% put's RDM closer to the 50% cap and is quite respectable.

[SpankWustler]

Contrary to what some of the DD's would have people believe, we don't fight brick wall's with infinite HP for loot.

This statement is true, well, other than the bit about those conspiracy theories you like to entertain. Most theory-crafting doesn't account for monsters dying because it's too big a variable, and this can be a problem.

I was expecting Temper to come out as a gain because of the huge duration Red Mage can currently achieve, even though some things (Steps, Blue Magic on high defense monsters) can come out as a loss. I would have been very surprised if it didn't, but maybe that would be something else to mention when asking for the spell to be adjusted.

As it is now, I can't help but wonder if either the base rate or the skill bonus have been left out. This is the case with Soothing Ruby, so maybe the same mistake happened with Temper. 5% seems very low, especially when the value could be 25% or more without any danger of making Red Mage the kind of melee some of you folks want.

[SpankWustler]

But does Temper stack with equipment/job traits?

If so, I cannot see a problem with 5% rate.

DA Khanda +2 = 10%
Atheling Mantle = +3%
Brutal Earring = +5%
Calmecac Trousers = +3%

RDM already has 20% in respectable equipment DA.

Potentially 30% if one opts to /WAR for the job trait (arguably not).

With DA Khanda +2 being upgradable in the next update for more DA, Temper's 5% put's RDM closer to the 50% cap and is quite respectable.

Since it's not possible to Double Attack on a Double Attack, getting closer to the cap would just make the spell's effect on attack rate relatively less. I see where you're coming from, though, since a 50% cap implies that 25+~35+% is a lot of Double Attack.

[Seriha]

But does Temper stack with equipment/job traits?

If so, I cannot see a problem with 5% rate.

DA Khanda +2 = 10%
Atheling Mantle = +3%
Brutal Earring = +5%
Calmecac Trousers = +3%

RDM already has 20% in respectable equipment DA.

Potentially 30% if one opts to /WAR for the job trait (arguably not).

With DA Khanda +2 being upgradable in the next update for more DA, Temper's 5% put's RDM closer to the 50% cap and is quite respectable.

Until the update goes live and people can use their parsers and such again, this'll be hard to test. As is, the proposition of a RDM subbing WAR makes some froth at the mouth, especially in a party setting.

[saevel]

But does Temper stack with equipment/job traits?

If so, I cannot see a problem with 5% rate.

DA Khanda +2 = 10%
Atheling Mantle = +3%
Brutal Earring = +5%
Calmecac Trousers = +3%

RDM already has 20% in respectable equipment DA.

Potentially 30% if one opts to /WAR for the job trait (arguably not).

With DA Khanda +2 being upgradable in the next update for more DA, Temper's 5% put's RDM closer to the 50% cap and is quite respectable.

You realize that DA experiences decreasing returns right?

Going from 0 to 5 DA is 105/100 = 5% improvement.

Going from 21 to 26 is,
126/121 = 1.0413, 1 4.1% improvement.

The presence of additional DA options does absolutely nothing for disposition of Temper's potency.

Your using 36mp and a few seconds to cast a spell that will give you a 4.1% improvement over 11:45min at best. More importantly is this is supposed to be a RDM "melee" update, and it's looking like complete sh!t so far. Worth casting yes, but barely. It's a brutal earring in spell form.

That being said, if SE just hasn't added scaling yet and we're really seeing the absolute bottom of the spell, then it's not so bad. Gain spells start at +5, so there is light at the end of the tunnel.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

What's the duration of Temper? At just 5% Double Attack, it very seems possible to actually lose attack rounds by taking the time to cast such a spell.

Edit: I think Red Mage's soloing capabilities in 2006 are probably the worst possible way to measure how the job should be updated today. The game is totally different nowadays.

3 minutes naturally, 9 minutes with composure.

ETA: Wow, the forums are messed up for me, keeps changing the order the posts appear in.

[Tashan]

Until the update goes live and people can use their parsers and such again, this'll be hard to test. As is, the proposition of a RDM subbing WAR makes some froth at the mouth, especially in a party setting.

Lol anti-rdm melee antics aren't as dramatic as people like to make out to be.

It's only when they do it wrong or over-exaggerate do peoPle react.