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  1. #11
    Player Diemond's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    8
    Character
    Diemond
    World
    Valefor
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 90
    Sch
    give libra the ability to tell monsters weaknesses and make it a shout instead of a say! since its basically an order from the battle field right, let it even pull a little hate it only makes sense.

    the storm effects should give auras that add increased att, increased def, double att.....etc. and if players are struke with an element spell or WS opposing their aura they take more dmg.
    (0)
    Last edited by Diemond; 07-21-2011 at 10:17 AM.

  2. #12
    Player TimeMage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    118
    Character
    Frejan
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    SCH Lv 99
    I posted in the stupid recall & retrace thread, trying to convince some people that we could care LESS about those spells, we want our damn fixes to healing capability, MV, Enlightment, and stupid new buff spells done.

    And while they're at it, why not fix our 2H, fix the broken additional effect on our +1/+2 Emp body (or tell us what the hell it does!), and make Haste able to be used with Accesion.
    (3)
    Frejan from Ragnarok, at your service.

  3. #13
    Player OMEGA_HACK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    124
    Character
    Altrage
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    SCH Lv 90
    TimeMage, the +2 body gives you 1% (or very very very low) enmity on a monster while casting Tier V nukes. I don't really think its broken, basically you can deal massive damage and pull absolutely no hate so long as you are in the right Art. The only fix the +2 SCH body needs is to change the Refresh to 2MP/tic (like ALL the other +2 Empy bodies with that stat; idk why SCH is the only one with 1MP/tic).

    I agree with all the other stuff though.
    (0)

  4. #14
    Player TimeMage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    118
    Character
    Frejan
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    SCH Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK View Post
    TimeMage, the +2 body gives you 1% (or very very very low) enmity on a monster while casting Tier V nukes. I don't really think its broken, basically you can deal massive damage and pull absolutely no hate so long as you are in the right Art.
    When was that discovered? Can you point me to wherever the research was posted? I'd be awesome if it's true.
    (0)
    Frejan from Ragnarok, at your service.

  5. #15
    Player Sasaraixx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    276
    Character
    Sasaraixx
    World
    Carbuncle
    Main Class
    SMN Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Raksha View Post
    The way I interpreted is that SCH is the one taking longer to cast the spells. Our taking longer to cast is compensated by being able to fill both roles.

    It isn't spectacularly worded though.
    I agree on both counts. That wording is needlessly confusing.

    I took a look at the Japanese version for clarification and not surprisingly, that wasn't entirely clear either.

    [白魔道士と黒魔道士のある程度の能力を持ちつつ、時間がかかるかわりに有効な支援、攻撃が行えるようなアビリティの追加/調整をしていく予定です。]

    My translation is, "Having skills comparable to that of WHM and BLM, we plan on adding/adjusting abilities that allow effective support or attacks in exchange for taking time." That isn't worderd spectacularly well either lol, but it is a little clearer I think. The "taking time" could refer to DOT spells (although th JP specifically says ability) or actual casting time.

    I would welcome TP spells as I think it fits in with the tactical aspect of the job, but they have to be potent. I wanted enmity spells for a long time, but the way they were implemented was terrible.

    Fix the Animus Spells.
    Fix Modus Veritas.
    Increase Aldoquium.
    Change the effect of Tabula Rasa (allow us to keep the strategems without having to reapply them)

    Do these 4 things and you will dealt with quite a few of my issues with the job. After that, then we can talk about Cure V, higher tier/more potent Helices, a new Klimaform type spell, and all of the other new goodies coming.
    (6)
    Last edited by Sasaraixx; 07-21-2011 at 06:22 PM.

  6. #16
    Player Raksha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,205
    Character
    Raksha
    World
    Lakshmi
    Main Class
    SCH Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK View Post
    TimeMage, the +2 body gives you 1% (or very very very low) enmity on a monster while casting Tier V nukes. I don't really think its broken, basically you can deal massive damage and pull absolutely no hate so long as you are in the right Art.
    Yeah I'm gonna need some confirmation on this too. If it actually does as you say then it isn't a 100% chance of it, because I pull hate with T5 nukes all the time. Also wouldn't explain what the "Enhances Addendum: White" does
    (2)

  7. #17
    Player
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    14
    As an up-front: I have not played SCH at high levels; in fact, my mains are the other three mages (WHM, RDM and BLM). Excluding RDM, the other two mages work fairly well in Abyssea now; WHM is where it should be, at the forefront of healing. BLM is, well, nukes still aren't nearly powerful enough to keep us on par with melee, but SE won't ever fix that. At least yellow procs make BLM useful.

    RDM and SCH, however, are obviously still broken (within Abyssea at least); SCH has got to be in the worst shape out of that pair. From my perspective, however, the problem with SE's vision is that it's still assigning to SCH a kind of "in between" role. Good at both WHM/BLM style roles, but excellent at neither. And if there is one thing the player community has cemented fairly well over the years, it is that jobs that don't excel in one particular needed aspect, almost never get invites. It is with this in mind that (and this is half-directed at SE's development team) I propose SCH be given a new vision, something unique that it does that no other mage job has much access to.

    TP and enmity manipulation would be a possible area, as mentioned. I think Enhancing Magic is probably the only category to really go with. Obviously Healing is a WHM's specialty; Enfeebling (should be) a RDM's specialty, and Elemental is for BLMs. Any attempt to make SCH relevant in those areas would almost by definition destroy the respective main jobs listed, for SCH can provide a lot more peripheral abilities than the others. That's what has made it so hard to buff in the first place.

    Enhancing, though, is ripe for some new abilities; you could have on the mage side some Fast Cast bonuses, perhaps. You could give them some spells that mimic certain MAB bonuses CORs currently provide (but not to the extent of COR, likely). And yes, some sort of Regain spell perhaps, or a spell version of SAM's TP transfer. Some enmity manipulation spells, not just monitoring. I think this is probably the best route to go in for SCH.

    TL;DR: I have trouble with the idea that SCH should remain as a magical generalist. It hurts their invites, and any attempt to power them up enough for this not to be an issue, will almost by definition destroy the balance with BLM or WHM. As long as Abyssea remains the end-game, "efficiency" is thrown out the window, and thus SCH hurts. They need to go in a new direction. Since RDM should be receiving some buffs to maintain its status as the elite enfeebling mage, this leaves only one real area to go to: Enhancing. Yes, it competes with BRD and COR, but there are still a lot of ideas they could throw in that they haven't used yet to give SCH a nice niche. Just my two cents, anyway.
    (3)

  8. #18
    Player OMEGA_HACK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    124
    Character
    Altrage
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    SCH Lv 90
    I done some tests on the body myself, basically Nuke in the Arts > Libra > Nuke in the arts > Libra > nuke outside the arts > Libra > Nuke in the arts without body > Libra rinse and repeat. Your enmity gain is really slow when you use them in the corresponding Arts.

    (you can do the tests yourself, it really doesn't give much hate at all) But the body really should be a 2mp/tic refresh (BLU even gets 2mp/tic on the +2 body and its a melee mage D


    On the note of Enhancing would be neat to be able to transfer TP gained into HP/MP or give something beneficial to another target of your choice at the cost of the TP.
    (0)

  9. #19
    Player Ahrana's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    69
    Character
    Ahrana
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    SCH Lv 96
    Well, here are the thoughts that I have on what they should do with scholar.

    1. Tier 2 storm spells
    2. MV needs to have it's accuracy returned to 100%. If you try to use MV on a helix spell that only has 1 tick left it fails.
    3. Access to cure V. If it's a huge issue make it only under add light.
    4. more tp/tick on regain

    The unique spells for scholar have been underwhelming, which has been a major disappointment since every other job seems to be getting goodies every cap increase. I don't really want recycled spells from other jobs, I would like scholar to have spells and abilities that make it bring a unique dynamic to fights. Some of the things I came up with are:

    Solid damage dual element spells so we can open light/darkness skillchains while only using a single strat. They don't need to be more powerful then tier V spells, but the added versatility of adding party damage is attractive.

    An additional high damage DoT that will stack with helix. Helix 2 spells are also welcome.

    A enfeeble that causes damage every time a skillchain or magic burst is used for the duration.

    Like many posters have said scholars need to bring useful spells to a party. They shouldn't be necessary for a party to be effective, but they should have something that makes others want to take them instead of another black/white/red mage.
    (3)

  10. #20
    Player brayen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    170
    Character
    Brayenn
    World
    Quetzalcoatl
    Main Class
    SAM Lv 95
    sch really has taken a bit of a backseat in the field of jobs. Lacks the harder cures and is behind on the nukes. Personally i am hoping to see at least comet on sch to be frank. Otherwise i am guessing it will fall even further from blm. Hopeing on cure 5 as well. if they will make sch overpowered or not really depends on how whm and blm turns out so hard to get into that kind of debate.

    As for the mentioned manifesto. While they seemed interesting ideas (particularly the tp reduction) it seems way too insignificant when compared to how the rest of the game is played. It would requier a heavy tp reduction to make an impact with even 3 maybe even 2 melees fighting a mob alone. Here is hoping that the confusing paragraph is leaning towards a positive but hard to say by how it is worded.

    I also agree, the last few lvls have been very disappointing. from my point of view sch just keep falling further behind. helices were bad before in most cases, then they destroyed the only saving grace form modes vertis, and now with harder enemies the dmg is even more worthless then before. The enmity spells are trash no matter how much i try to make use of them i still have trouble trying to match pace with a blm without dying while they simply shed all their hate in 1 JA. On top of that we get libra..why? so we know when we are about done being able to nuke i suppose? really isnt even worth it either cuz ull be walking into AoE range. To top it off our one strong area that we made some extra leg room (mp maintenance) has been made a joke. All jobs can get mnore refresh then us(see af3 bodies refresh) and all we get is a faster sublimation charge. With recent changes sch really has taken a hit, and notice i have yet to talk about inside abyssea where sch is seldom used.

    ...cutting my rant short here ...... i was really fond of sch and have not used it outside of keeping it's lvl up to date. Havnt even been able to wear my AF3 and it was one of the first ones i completed *sigh*

    i know it is a hard job to balance being both an offensive and defensive job so here is to keeping my hopes up!

    oh and to the above post i agree with 1 2 and 3
    4 i dont think is needed, the spell isnt something anyone is going to rely on anyways, pretty meh spell but it gets me an extra refresh tic with that neck that converts tp to mp lol..point being however is that itll need to be much higher before it becomes something desired.
    (0)

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