Screwed again: Proposed THF job adjustments.

[Insaniac]

This feels like an exercise in futility since we have been saying this for months now and SE clearly didn't read any of it or just doesn't care.

Vision
Stealthy pickpockets that duck and weave to land sneak attacks while keeping party enmity under control from the shadows.

This is complete nonsense. 2 minutes into a fight a THF has almost no impact on enmity. TAing a tank with capped hate does nothing. Collabo on a DD gets hate off of them for a total of 1 second. Collabo on a BLM gets hate off of them for 1 nuke. THF is useless in this dept.

We wish to see thieves further develop the cunning they are so aptly known for by providing them with even more means of manipulating enmity and continuing to fatten the party's coffers.

This is the part that makes me think I shouldn't even bother. What kind of a role is this to play? We all know our enmity abilities do pretty much nothing anymore which leaves us with the job of hitting the enemy twice every minute and then being blamed when we don't get what we want.

Example Adjustments

Adding a new ability that complements Sneak Attack and Trick Attack.

This one could be something good but even if it is it's not enough of a damage buff. THF is completely outclassed by dancers when it comes to daggers. This is NONSENSE. This would be along the lines of PUP being better at HtH damage than MNK... or SCHs having Cure 6.

Raising the chances of successfully executing Steal and Despoil commensurate with Treasure Hunter.

Really SE? Higher steal rates? Higher despoil? First off both of these JA are useless in an HNM setting. USELESS. The only thing steal is good for is aura steal and by raising the success rate of steal you are lowering the success rate of the only good thing about the JA.

Adding a new ability that intimidates an enemy in proportion to the number of members in the party.

Cool another JA that will not help us with the one thing we are actually still good at. Low man tanking. This will surely be a warcry type ability and only affect the members of your party so unless the thf is in the tank party, which it won't be, this JA will suck and bring almost nothing to the table.

So.. Here we are again. TH whores. Why has every post on this forum been completely ignored? I admit some of the ideas are terrible and unbalanced/unrealistic but a lot of them are reasonable requests for more DD power (at least enough to put DNC back in 2nd place when it comes to daggers) and steal type abilities that actually do something. How could you possibly think the 2nd and 3rd examples are things we would be interested in?
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MAJOR EDITS!!!

Since this has turned into much more than just the rage thread it started as I went through and tried to gather some stuff that shouldn't be lost in the vastness of the thread.

First we have the ComRep reply.


And then -Adjustment suggestions that have been peppered throughout the thread.

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.htm...2&h=50&p=3#124

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post147335

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post147427

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post147851

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post148821

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post153039

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post153439

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post173312

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post173370

Finally - The perceived problems that we ,for the most part ,were able to agree on once the RAGE settled

1) THF has no real use. TH2 is the best form of TH in terms of noticeable boosts, anything past that is all pretty much unnoticeable/unseeable boosts. So we're not even good for that beyond placebo effects.

2) We have no real DD capabilities, similar to a lot of lesser DD jobs, Except THF falls further behind than others in this Gap. Since 75 the gap between THFs power and the next best DD has widened much further. In this field, we don't ask to be top tier DD, simply to have the gap lessened.

3) Devs want us to be support class and "Control enmity" and as it stands THF has no real methods to "Control" enmity. 2 Abilities on a shared timer and no way to disperse extra Enmity does not a master make. So as far as the Devs "vision" of the job goes we even lack capabilities there

4) Over-all Lack of Uniqueness of the job, usefulness of the job. Right now the only thing keeping THF relevant is ignorance of Treasure Hunter, But once that becomes common knowledge I doubt THF will keep its head above water.

5) We're all disappointed by the BS Responses we got earlier, which basically to summarize tell us things like "Aura Steal is too powerful to separate from Steal, or Reduce timer", and "You can't have Subtle Blow because You melee for TH upgrades, and we feel that balances it", etc.

6) Practically 0 job growth since the level cap increases. THF is more or less the same exact job it was at level 75 where most other jobs have grown either slightly or exponentially. TH3 and the proc system seems to have been just a placebo put in place to keep THFs from being completely forgotten when TH2 became sub-able.

[Nebo]

Adding a new ability that intimidates an enemy in proportion to the number of members in the party.

[SIZE="6"]STOP. GIVING. THF. [SIZE="7"] THESE RETARDED.[/SIZE] PARTY ONLY RESTRICTIONS. ON JOB ABILITIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![/SIZE]

[Insaniac]

STOP. GIVING. THF. THESE RETARDED. PARTY ONLY RESTRICTIONS.ON JOB ABILITIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

^ DNC and NIN already solo far better than THF so why can't we get some solo buffs?

[Nebo]

Raising the chances of successfully executing Steal and Despoil commensurate with Treasure Hunter.

The chance of steal and despoil success is not the problem. The problem is that the abilities themselves are useless compounded by the fact that they don't work on NM's or any worthwhile content.

First and foremost, their recast timers need to be seperated and lowered. If you don't start with this, just leave them alone. Anything you do with them is just going to make people angry.

Second, despoil needs to have NOTHING to do with stealing items. IT is a half assed joke of an ability that lives between stealing useless crap items that NO ONE cares about and inflicting a variable enfeebling effects that we cannot make use of.

Despoil should inflict and then steal its enfeebling effect. And you need to be able to specificy which effect it will be....or it will remain.....USELESS.

Steal and Aurasteal need to be seperated. Non negotiable. If you are increasing the success rate of steal, that only means that it proc before aurasteal more often.

That aside, the issue with steal is not its success rate. It is the stupid 5 minute recast timer that you attach to everything, compounded by a retardedly low success rate, made largely irrelevant due to the fact that there is nothing really worth stealing in this game.

HAVE YOU BEEN LISTENING TO US AT ALL????

[Alukat]

piece of gear which augments trick attack to transfer x% of thf's enmity to the TA'd target, makes sneak attack possible and will do significant changes to thf's dmg output.

THF needs to get rid of some enmity somehow, otherwise Sneak attack will still be useless!!!!!!

steal/despoil. to make them usefull the timers needs to be seperated & lowered and items need to be added on NMs/HNMs.
this items should be only obtainable via steal/despoil and they should be ingredients for high end gear/food.

otherwise steal/despoil will still be useless!!!!

JA for intimidation? seriously? that's beastmasters job (killer instinct)!!!!!

Edit:
and since weakness targeting th isn't required as it was without it,maybe th isn't neccessary at all anymore

[StingRay104]

Btw did you all see that war is getting their own version of sneak attack, from any direction, ty SE............/rage.

[Laphine]

I'm not going to rage i swear...lol

I didn't think the vision of THF was so bad actually. Kinda unreal: if we duck and weave, the mob is targeting us and there sure won't be any sneak attack happening then lol. But not so bad anyway.

This makes me worry about that JA to complement SA/TA. If it's an instant use JA, this could mean we will become more JA spammy and lose even more dps due their delay. So i hope it's something like a stance, 5min recast/duration, and as long as its up, it's affecting our sa/ta in some way.

War is also getting a force crit attack ja...This comes easy for them since they already had mighty strikes i guess. But really, THF losing what i thought was the only thing unique sucks. A lot.

DNC getting AC...haha...Where in their vision of DNC implied anything about them as DDs? I can't see it. This JA,climactic flourish, and probably more i can't remember, certainly have nothing to do with buffing the pt and debuffing the enemies that they talked about there.

[Insaniac]

The WAR ability says "the next melee hit" so I don't think it will work with WSs. At least I hope not.

[StingRay104]

The WAR ability says "the next melee hit" so I don't think it will work with WSs. At least I hope not.

A lot of ppl say the devs don't play the game and thus they suck at giving us good updates. I how ever disagree, they do play the game but they only play the job war. It all makes since seeing as how war gets everything while other jobs suffer, hell sam only got 1 update til this past one (No one counts hamanhoa because its a useless effect). Its most likely gonna be ws acceptable because god forbid they deny war all the damage goodies.

[Laphine]

Oh i checked the french version and wording is a bit different on the sa/ta thing. Gotta say that i don't speak french lol (so i could be wrong), just used the powah of having a latin based mother language.

Anyways, it actually says something about a new skill on the lines of sneak attack and trick attack. So, a new crit forcing ja for us too?! Quite promising actually!