It's time Summoner got Bahamut.

[Thanotos]

idk why people keep saying they wouldnt want bahamut if they made him into a 2hr only avatar, I would love to have bahamut in any form possible, regardless of how situational it may be.

[Yygdrasil]

Before anyone else bothers to suggest Bahamut as an Avatar... please take the time to complete CoP. If you bothered to pay attention to the story at all... you'd realize that its simply not possible to fit him in as an Avatar based exclusively on the storyline.

Hell... it was a stretch for them to even give us Fenrir considering the storyline of WotG: Windurst.

[Babekeke]

Hell... it was a stretch for them to even give us Fenrir considering the storyline of WotG: Windurst.

although we got fenrir many years before WoTG even came out >.>

[Yygdrasil]

I would like to think that the lore and history within a game was developed long before the game itself. Just because we didn't have the expansion yet doesn't automatically mean that the developers just came up with the WotG storyline on the fly.

Think about it guy. What do we usually get years in advance of almost every major title? We get spoilers... bits of STORY... and information about the game that has already been decided more often than not. I would venture a guess that Fenrir's entire involvement in FFXI was planned out before we ever got our hands on the original launch.

What I'm saying is that it's a stretch that they gave him to us given the powerful role he plays in the past. I agree that we should not get Bahamut for the same reason. Bahamut is far too powerful and far too involved in the Missions to be given to us as an Avatar.

[Tannlore]

I would like to think that the lore and history within a game was developed long before the game itself. Just because we didn't have the expansion yet doesn't automatically mean that the developers just came up with the WotG storyline on the fly.

Think about it guy. What do we usually get years in advance of almost every major title? We get spoilers... bits of STORY... and information about the game that has already been decided more often than not. I would venture a guess that Fenrir's entire involvement in FFXI was planned out before we ever got our hands on the original launch.

It's more like a general outline of story and finer points and details ironed out. We actually have a peek into what they had in mind back when RotZ was released. Go look on the net and you'll find the sketches, interviews, commentary and such (hope you can read Japanese). I really don't think they had the fine details of WotG scripted deeply until it was time to do so. Especially considering when they trademarked the expansion. Think about what it takes to write a book, then to write a series of books. go look at Harry Potter's author J.K Rowling, then look at J.R.R. Tolkien and compare planning processes for epic size story (like you get in this game).

Do you really think when FF11 was released they had all the current expacs and add-ons completely planned, scripted, thought out? Every word, nuance, event? Tanaka himself said they had to adapt to the changes in technology that changed CS in WotG to be so much better than before. One can only "plan" so much to the point where you're wasting time by over planning. As the Goblin credo goes: Time is money friend.

What I'm saying is that it's a stretch that they gave him to us given the powerful role he plays in the past. I agree that we should not get Bahamut for the same reason. Bahamut is far too powerful and far too involved in the Missions to be given to us as an Avatar.

On Fenrir: Considering we have access to the other avatars who are just as, if not more powerful than Fenrir I don't see a problem given Fenrir's power in the past. (do waking the beast, you'll find out just how scary powerful the primes really are.) We already knew he was the one who ravaged that continent way before WotG was released because of the story of the game. (again that general rough outline).

On Bahamut:
I'm sorry, Bahamut? That would be the one a few Zilart mannequins chained up rather effortlessly? The same mannequins you the player dismantle rather easily? This would be the same avatar that couldn't do what you the player did? (defeat Promathia).

No, currently players are so much more powerful that Bahamut he should rightly fear them. If the adventurers of Vanadiel one day decided Bahamut must die. He ... will... die. If the paternal creator deity can fall to a handful of adventurers back at 75, what will happen at 99? Esp. considering players can defeat him already in a bcnm where he gets help from his fellow HNM Wyrms!

I think you give bahamut too much credit. We don't get him for two simple reasons: He's too big for players to cart around behind them (he's Massive folks... seriously, go use model viewer and see) and it would take too much manpower to make him useable in the typical smn fashion.

What I'm seeing here is a disconnect with the power of the avatars vs. what we can do. We are summoners who summon an aspect of their great power: A small aspect. There's a reason smn are heretics in Vanadiel, a very good reason. One who can call the gods should rightly be feared. Imagine one day if your Ramuh suddenly decided to fully wake up while you had him out? You would die, yes you the smn.


Now, Bahamut as a 2-hour? I could see him being a new merited 2-hour

[Shadotter]

Well, story wise he is supposed to be the most powerful of the terrestrial avatars, despite that. What if though you were only able to summon even less of him, maybe having him not appear or auto attack but just have the bloodpacts available. or maybe making a couple one hit spells similar to the effects of 2 hour summons without actually summoning. Or maybe even making it so that summoning requires the use of an item or something that gets used up and needs replacing every so often.

[ShadowHeart]

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Wh...f_the_Wyrmking

bring it to us SE its all right there to be done!!!!!!!

ki is already there just need to figure out its abilities and make it so u have to do the bcnm battle

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/The_Wyrmking_Descends

[Sargent]

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Wh...f_the_Wyrmking

bring it to us SE its all right there to be done!!!!!!!

ki is already there just need to figure out its abilities and make it so u have to do the bcnm battle

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/The_Wyrmking_Descends

Don't give SE ideas, this is how they'd end up "reviving" ENMs. Seriously, getting an Ouryu pop was one of the biggest pains in this game and the main reason I don't have a Bahamut's.

[Rakshaka]

Quote from the Relic/Mythic/Empy thread: "Additional planned features, such as equipment-specific magic spells and pets, have been postponed to allow...", Maybe we'll be able to summon Bahamut or another avatar via one of the relic/mythic/empy staves.

[Fyreus]

They could stick some lore in the game mechanics and make fenrir somewhat strong in some way possible. We don't need new avatars, they need to convert our current avatars into usable summons. I'd love to have a fast and strong fenrir or not have to always use my Lv75 attacks vs mobs (dunno why they put haste, blink, walk speed, healing, nukes, and the strongest PHY pact, and useful special gear on 1 avatar...) while wondering why in the world i went to fight that stupid fast wolf and his sleepga happy friend only to not have any use for them.