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Thread: Enmity Cap

  1. #1
    Player Kavik's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    Sandy
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    Character
    Kavik
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    PLD Lv 99

    Enmity Cap

    Ok so i had this really long, really well thought out message with examples and such and then i went to look up a specific term on wiki and my stupid firefox crashed so i lost it. Anyway, with the addition of Rune Fencer something has GOT to be changed about enmity or rune fencer will ONLY be used for it's 'attack runes' and not as a tank which is what it is intended to be. This is no longer just a pld problem or a problem generated by jobs in abyssea, where anyone can tank with the right atma's. With the introduction of the new expansion also, we wont be having those abyssean or voidwatch buffs, especially in the beginning. So PLEASE PLEASE PLLLLLLLLLEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAASE make a TANK a TANK and make it possible to get MORE enmity then other jobs in order to hold the mobs attention rather then just making them a hold job for people to recover or keep something off them. Otherwise, we have pld's with aegis, why do we even need rune fencer?
    (5)
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  2. #2
    Player Lordos's Avatar
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    Nov 2011
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    ドイツ / Germany
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    Character
    Lordos
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    Easy 2 fix all action have 2 do less hate, that all lol. I really hope the fixing this before new tank job because i gone lvl RUN ;D
    (0)

  3. #3
    Player Twille's Avatar
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    Character
    Twille
    World
    Quetzalcoatl
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    WAR Lv 99
    At what point did SE state that this new job is intended to be a tank?
    (0)

  4. #4
    Player hiko's Avatar
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    Character
    Meuporg
    World
    Ragnarok
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    BST Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Twille View Post
    At what point did SE state that this new job is intended to be a tank?
    from vanafest report:
    - Their exceptional magic defense and elemental resistance put them squarely in the tank category, along with paladins and ninjas.
    (4)

  5. #5
    Player Kavik's Avatar
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    Kavik
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    Fenrir
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    PLD Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Lordos View Post
    Easy 2 fix all action have 2 do less hate, that all lol. I really hope the fixing this before new tank job because i gone lvl RUN ;D
    This doesn't help at all. You'll still all hit hate cap and be on equal footing regardless of how long it takes to get there. It ends up looking like this (small numbers because they are easier to work with), 10+10+10+10+10+10+10+10+10+10=100
    50+50 = 100 <-- currently how it basically breaks down.
    90+10 = 100
    100+20 = 100

    Now if you were to make everything generate less enmity you get something like,
    1 X 100 = 100 actions you would still cap out at 100. Meaning whoever preforms the most actions the fastest would indeed get capped enmity first, but as the battle wore on more people would hit cap and you'd still be in the same boat, the mob going everywhere and no control at all.

    I just thought of this while i was doing dishes.... how about we make animus spells raise/lower the amount of enmity that can be completely acquired? For example you cast augeo on the pld, he can get 110 enmity, cast minuo on someone else and they can only get 90? OR have them directly raise/lower enmity, so cast augeo on pld and he instantly gets 50, cast minueo on war and he instantly loses 50, instead of them having actions generate more/less enmity, since everyone will hit cap anyway they're a little but pointless, this would make them tremendously useful.
    (0)
    Last edited by Kavik; 06-30-2012 at 12:17 AM.
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  6. #6
    Player Llana_Virren's Avatar
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    Apr 2012
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    Okinawa, Japan!!
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    Character
    Llana
    World
    Lakshmi
    Main Class
    WHM Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Kavik View Post
    This doesn't help at all. You'll still all hit hate cap and be on equal footing regardless of how long it takes to get there. It ends up looking like this (small numbers because they are easier to work with), 10+10+10+10+10+10+10+10+10+10=100
    50+50 = 100 <-- currently how it basically breaks down.
    90+10 = 100
    100+20 = 100

    Now if you were to make everything generate less enmity you get something like,
    1 X 100 = 100 actions you would still cap out at 100. Meaning whoever preforms the most actions the fastest would indeed get capped enmity first, but as the battle wore on more people would hit cap and you'd still be in the same boat, the mob going everywhere and no control at all.
    Assuming anyone in your party/alliance is still alive. In all events where "tanking" would seem useful, the monsters are so overpowered that you wouldn't be able to survive long enough to enjoy your time as tank.

    Personally, and I know this makes it sound a lot simpler than it is, but I think that non-tanking classes (read as: non-PLD, NIN, RNK, WAR) should have a lower cap on enmity, in addition of course to dramatically reducing enmity gained through damage.
    (2)


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  7. #7
    Player Kavik's Avatar
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    Kavik
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    PLD Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Llana_Virren View Post
    Assuming anyone in your party/alliance is still alive. In all events where "tanking" would seem useful, the monsters are so overpowered that you wouldn't be able to survive long enough to enjoy your time as tank.

    Personally, and I know this makes it sound a lot simpler than it is, but I think that non-tanking classes (read as: non-PLD, NIN, RNK, WAR) should have a lower cap on enmity, in addition of course to dramatically reducing enmity gained through damage.
    Unfortunately they have said already they will never do this because it amounts to the melee doing whatever the hell they want without any consequences, ie pulling hate.

    Also, as to my animus suggestion, they could make it either an incredibly long recast or make it so they have the normal effect unless you use a certain strategem to make it the 'enhanced' properties I listed above, so you could not always control the enmity of every single person in the party, since you already cannot cast those spells outside of alliance.
    (0)
    FFXI forever! 99 PLD THF DRG DNC WHM SCH BRD BLM BLU BST
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  8. #8
    Player hiko's Avatar
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    Character
    Meuporg
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    BST Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Kavik View Post

    Now if you were to make everything generate less enmity you get something like,
    1 X 100 = 100 actions you would still cap out at 100. Meaning whoever preforms the most actions the fastest would indeed get capped enmity first, but as the battle wore on more people would hit cap and you'd still be in the same boat, the mob going everywhere and no control at all.
    and monster HP will be lower!
    let assume(random numbers and ideal world for easyness):
    10 DD that parse equaly
    300k hp monster
    a-1dmg=1CE
    all DD reach cap after 10*10kDMG=100k=33% of monster hp=> you spend 2/3 of the fight with caotic hate

    b) lower it so 1dmg=0.5CE
    your DD cap after 200kdmg you only spend 1/3 of the fight with chaotic hate, with some hate control you can spend near whole fight without chaotic enmity.

    hiting enmity cap is not the issue, the issue is that when you hit it monster still have most of his HP, if you cap when monster is near dead it doesnt matter
    (1)

  9. #9
    Player Manux's Avatar
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    Aug 2011
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    121
    Character
    Materdark
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    NIN Lv 99
    any idea the mods can change the the forum title because theres no tank in this game when it comes to tanking.
    I think SE needs to focus on DD for pld now because they kind of useless.
    (0)

  10. #10
    Player Blah's Avatar
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    Jun 2013
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    It seems simple

    What they could do is have each job type have a different "normal" enmity cap. "Tanks" have something like 1000, "healers" have like 300 or 400 "dds" have maybe 800 and the rest have between 500 to 700. Then have gear (as always) to increase the normal cap if need be. And oh yeah raise the enmity cap to around 1000. The only problem I see is if they "forget" to + the gear that's out now accordingly or if they don't make high enmity gear for mages who still pl. But you won't do that right SE?
    (0)
    Last edited by Blah; 02-14-2014 at 02:12 AM. Reason: A very silly mistake

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